do you like meeting new people?

Otherwise I am not really bothered, but kind of like my own time and space (must save for deposit on my own flat with noone else, sharpish).

I generally *don't* like having conversations with random "bus stop" strangers, unless I'm in a very good, social mood. (Which is quite rare lately.)

Gah, so much depends on my own mood, and my own level of happiness and comfort with myself, that the environmental stuff is pretty much moot.

In FAP-type situations, I generally stay more and more zipped because they tend to talk about things in which I'm not interested and it is therefore difficult to get on with people who are clearly on a different wavelength.

I hate bars and parties and avoid both like the plague so can't comment on that question. With two or three people I'm OK. With crowds, forget it, instant claustrophobia.

In terms of shopping and bus stops I do not, as it were, try it.

London is not the friendliest of places in which to live but then again it's not as if I've made much of an effort to change that environment.

I think the only time I end up talking to strangers on public transport is when something's gone wrong, e.g. the bus is late or has broken down or the driver think its perfectly acceptable to stop the bus and have a fag midway through the route (which happens more often than you might think). That is the time when I turn to the person next to me and sigh or give a helpless grin and we'll start having a conversation about how awful it is. I seem to remember Tom saying something similar once, comparing this situation with the camarderie of strangers in the Blitz or something. Mind you, I may be remembering this wrong.

I used to be quite shy in social situations and would never initiate a conversation. Nowadays I feel quite happy doing it and so am always glad to meet new ppl. I do occasionally get knocked back by those annoying twats who react in a sarcastic way to something I say that they don't find particularly interesting, but I suppose it's annoying to them if I'm boring them so I can't really complain. The knock back doesn't last v long however, it's not like aI go round for weeks afterwards worried that i'm boring or anything like that.

When I was say 17-18 I constantly wished I could get to know more people and talk more to strangers, but I always felt too freaky.

I never, ever talk to strangers at the bus stop or such. Occasionally I might talk to strangers at a party, almost never at a bar (maybe just some small talk in the line to the toilet).

Actually there have been a few instances recently when I've been on public transport, been sitting across from someone who seems nice, and just randomly engaged them in conversation. People are a lot more friendly if you show some initiative.

It's like the weather isn't it? The one thing that affects everyone whoever they are. When all else fails, one can always complain about the shit weather.
And I know I keep bringing up raving these days, but I think it's nice that in this environment, you can talk to (almost) anyone and they'll want to be your friend - or at least give you the time of day. Of course drugs are involved but the change in social stimulus is quite amazing really.

I've never been comfortable talking to other blokes. Most of my friends, certainly the vast majority of people to whom I feel comfortable talking/confiding, are of the opposite sex. I told Kate about this last year and she reckoned that it was extremely unhealthy. And it's also another big barrier to my feeling comfortable at FAPs - I just can't get with the whole "bloke thing."

Yeh, I know that feeling. I get a bit frustrated if my group of friends is unwilling to even TRY accepting someone new into our fold or whatever, which can happen sometimes. I guess I do it sometimes too. It's not so much distrust as "yeh, these people are okay but not really my cup of tea".

is raving sweeping ILX or something? Christ, that sounds good.

other times, i'll have random coversations with loads of strangers about anything. sometimes at my initiative, sometimes theirs (god, i spend too much time at namco station. a security guard approached me because he remembered me 'for being so damn good at the sword game, and the most honest person i've met' [for turning in the phone that stevem & ken found] and so i talked to him for a while, although it was weird and slightly humiliating that i'm that much of a geek)

also, i did have to 'start from scratch' when i moved here, so all my english friends are new friends. maybe that's why i don't bother meeting people these days-- the last three years have been all about the new friend campaign!

I still do feel that it is probably an unhealthy sign if one's friends are entirely *all* of one gender, regardless of whether that is the same or opposite gender as oneself.

Obviously, many people will have a preference one way or another, often depending on their interests, and how that correlates to gender stereotypes. (Back in the 90s, when I was a computer programmer by day, and a session player by night, most of the people I met were men, so most of my friends were men. But this has evened out considerably.)

But I am actually suspicious of people who have *no* friends of a certain gender, over the age of about 18. That does worry me.

To an extent. Many people take this shit too far and neglect to acknowledge the obvious and fundamental differences between men and women, which I think can be equally unhealthy.

I behave the same way with men and women I think, it's just that I don't have that many woman friends.

God, protect me from all those fevered egos...

hmm.. Some people just do like being around their own/opposite sex citing that they can't feel at ease among others. I can kind of see that, although it is admittedly a little narrow-minded because not all guys are blokey-blokes who sing rugby songs and talk about cars and not all girls are into shopping and cattiness so I see where you're coming from.

Which is a shame, but still...

QED.

(nb: 'confidante' type person does not imply wanting to go to bed with them)

I'm with Alba to an extent on the thing about groups - part of the excitement of meeting a new person, for me, is knowing that they could be the gateway to a whole new group of friends. To the extent that I sometimes get a bit disappointed if this doesn't happen, which isn't really fair on the other person, but then again I socialise with big groups far more than individuals anyway so maybe its understandable. I agree that sometimes this is also motivated by looking for potential partners, and I'm not really sure this is fair either, but I suppose its human.

I tend to go through waves of meeting lots of new people at once, the last time was around February and there might be another similar point on the horizon fairly soon.

Possibly because none of my friends are dirty dronerock people, so they don't know any dirty dronerock boys!

(Actually, that's not true. Last two boys were actually introduced to me by the same person. I SHOULD KILL HER!!! WITH GUNS!!!!!)

(Not that I've ever actually dated one. I think I'd like to start.)

I think there are several types of situation being described here though : being lonely and wanting friends is different from being happy to chat to someone on a bus who you will prob never see again.

I do chat to people on public transport and I've never been beaten up yet! In fact I've had some really good chats with people on the train after a few jars in central London. I can't deny that beer helps.

That's me in a nutshell too, Alba. I think I wish life was still like pre-school - you didn't really have to make an effort to make friends because they were either the person who lent their purple crayon to you, or your parents chose them for you.

I *would* like a new circle of undemanding friends who all hung out in the same place like in Cheers or something. Or like university, for that matter.

Its not exclusively about meeting potential partners though, although there aren't many single people who wouldn't admit to that being in the back of their mind. But I'm certainly not about to lose interest in that group if this mystical partner is unforthcoming - provided I enjoy their company obviously.

For a while when I was younger, I mean specifically 16-20, I deliberately sought out groups of friends according to whether they'd want to do the same things as me, to find companions for things I didn't want to do on my own (principally going to gigs etc). I don't do that as much any more, possibly because I don't feel as many holes in my life. Although one of the many great things about meeting Steve, Gareth, Anna, Toby etc is that there are people I can arrange to go out dancing with if I want (even if I have been rubbish in that regard lately).

Am I? Apologies.

x-post - not agressive, just visibly sexual. It's like if there were two Nick South4lls.

Me too, it's slightly scary. Except for all of the horndoggery, of course.

Not if you don't live in London though! It has dawned on me that the only way, at my age, to meet a GROUP of new people is to Do An Activity like yoga or life drawing or something godawful like that. I suppose I have met a few new people through my MA but it's not like undergraduate courses where everyone just gets drunk and shags each other bonds in the first week. The transition from classroom to pub is just less natural when you're all old and have jobs and lives outside of being a student :(

The bouncer lets us in and we go up to the second floor and order drinks.

About 45 minutes later or so the same fucking frathole shows up at my table and asks me why I have beef and informs me that I didn't see what happened BEFORE he threw the drink so I should mind my own fucking business. I tell him I saw what I saw and he should take credit for his behavior and not be a lying schmuck, then I turn around and go back to my pilsner because this is not going anywhere good.

He shouts "Yeah, stare at me, you fucking nigger."

Then he walks off somewhere and his buddy in the black t-shirt has some words with Ally and I which fall quite short of apologetic and our friend comes back from the restroom and we finish our drinks and go home. I grind my teeth some more.

I hate meeting new people.

i love that other people use that word.

Somebody tell me again what's good about living in the capital?

Okay now there's a fire in my building or some shit and I have to evacuate while I'm on hold with the cable company, I'm going to have to start all over.

I'm going to lose it.

I like some of them.

I have a vague memory of it being about drugs.

also not sure that getting mugged or whatever else counts as 'meeting new people', tom.

xpost-- old people? hmm. cruising the nursing homes, ronan?

NOT each other. Necessarily.

I'm going to lose it.

Is moving not an option?

I do try to meet new peeps tho', cause I'm just that kind of horndogguy.

i'm not a DC fan, either. only have had bad times there, with several major(ly bad) events.

except going to see the pandas when i was 8. that was ok.

Me too, it's slightly scary. Except for all of the horndoggery, of course.

*concludes horndoggery is not scary*

My answer is that I can be ridiculously gregarious at points and extremely 'oh go AWAY' at others. So sometimes I'm very open to meeting new people -- as perhaps should surprise nobody who I've met through the eight million board FAPs -- and at other points it should be concluded that if I am reading a book and ignoring you studiously or in fact walking away from you swiftly that perhaps I am not particularly interested in conversation at the present time.

Generally, though, meeting new friends = great! I have my two very closest friends now -- the chance of gaining a third will happen when I find That Special Someone, I trust and hope.

No idea - it's fun while it's happening. I'm sure there is absolutely no point in seeing them ever again though.

I don't want to fuck "old people", by which I meant people I have known for a long time, and not the aged.

I think generally the way it works is if they are assholes when they are not on drugs you may not like them.

fwiw one of the people I've seen most in the last few months is someone who for the first year or two of our relationship I never saw off drugs. I think that's probably the exception to the rule though.

(x-post)

mandee, i know what you mean! i only meet a few people that seem to get as excited to have a new friend as i am, but when it happens, it's fantastic. some of my friends gets what we call 'friend crushes'-- you want to hang out all the time, go out to play, talk to each other way too much, but it isn't a normal crush because the fancying part isn't there...it's amazing when you friendcrush someone that seems to friendcrush you back.

i think about half of my friendcrushes work out in the longer term. maybe a little less. but part of that is due to me moving around so much...

It's nice to make new friends. I like my acquaintances to become friends if possible. I don't really go out of my way (like go to new places etc) to make new friends, as I feel I've got some good ones already, but I'll never discount the possibility of making some new ones.

Or is it that you would like to in most circumstances but are rendered mute by shyness?

Sometimes rendered mute yeah, sometimes if it's a pub or something it's too noisy and I can't follow conversations. I think I have bad hearing. Sometimes, I get home and think of all the things I should have said. I really find it better to be in a small group or just hanging out with one other person.

What if you are in a group where most people know each other but you don't? Will you step in and try and get on their wavelengths or stay zipped?

If it was like friends of friends at a party, then I would probably stay zipped and edge closer to the door. With something like a FAP, it's different coz I sorta knew them already...so the wavelength is easier to find.

Would you strike up conversation with someone you didn't know if you were at the bar or at a party? What about non-social events such as doing the shopping or waiting at the bus stop?

No, never.

I'm also interested in whereabouts you live - do you think that your environment has an impact on the way you meet people or your trust of strangers?

London, you'll never see the same person twice.

i have been known to crush a friend or two

My flatmate gets friendcrushes all the time, he tends to throw himself into new friendships right at the deep end. Which helps as he's just moved to London (and it benefits me as well).

I've had a few experiences of meeting somebody and immediately having a three-hour-long conversation. One turned into a two-year relationship. Several inspired great friendships and a few led to pathetic crush experiences (I can get too attached too quickly sometimes). It usually helps to be hanging out with a more sociable friend, one who inspires me to carry my own weight in the meeting-people game.

Would you go out of your way to make new friends or acquaintances, or do you find that most of the time you can't be bothered?

I don't go out of my way, necessarily, but I try to be friendly and open, for the most part.

Or is it that you would like to in most circumstances but are rendered mute by shyness?

Shyness isn't really a factor, it more depends on the circumstances. I mean I am shy around cute girls, to name one example, but I'll still be able to speak/crack jokes/whatnot.

What if you are in a group where most people know each other but you don't? Will you step in and try and get on their wavelengths or stay zipped?

If I'm already in that group, I assume that there's a reason, so being shy or quiet doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

Would you strike up conversation with someone you didn't know if you were at the bar or at a party?

Depends on teh sitch. I generally probably wouldn't go first, but there's exceptions to everything. I'm not sure the last time I did this, though.

What about non-social events such as doing the shopping or waiting at the bus stop?

These are the most awkward ones, so I tend not to. I know the last thing I want, generally, is to be hassled while going about my business, so I sort of assume others are like that too. Again, though, it depends.

I'm also interested in whereabouts you live - do you think that your environment has an impact on the way you meet people or your trust of strangers?

Yes. See above.

The thing I like about London is what seems like an unlimited number of cool new people to meet and a far more ways to meet them. I never felt this really in the other places I've lived in.

What, so you thought only girls get crushes on friends of the opposite sex? What madness is this? In my world it's almost always the other way round.

Hmm, this wanders away from the point some, but I think I'll leave it in anyway.

No. That's not what I meant. Don't worry, forget about it ;-)

This is the nature of text-based communication. You don't get the same visual cues of approval and such that you get in face-to-face situations, so you only really get feedback on your input when you do or say something particularly outrageous, interesting, funny, or just provocative. Having been on the internet for 10 years now, and using text-based-electro-instantaneous-communication in general for longer, I'm pretty well adjusted to the dynamics at play with relationships online. Essentially you have to take everything you read with a grain of salt, as for every one thing you know about the people you're talking to there are a thousand you don't.

Since you were 11? Bionic Boy!

The one thing you don't realize about Andrew until you meet him is that his reptilian forked tongue and scaly skin are a sign of excellent evolutionary mutation in Australia.

I do go out of my way to talk to people - whether this is because I like people and find them largely fascinating or because I just like to talk is up in the air.

What if you are in a group where most people know each other but you don't? Will you step in and try and get on their wavelengths or stay zipped?

I pick someone and try to strike up a conversation. I don't go out if I don't feel like talking.

Would you strike up conversation with someone you didn't know if you were at the bar or at a party? What about non-social events such as doing the shopping or waiting at the bus stop?

Yes, absolutely. Again, I like to talk, and I really do enjoy learning about people.

I'm also interested in whereabouts you live - do you think that your environment has an impact on the way you meet people or your trust of strangers?

Trust of strangers, certainly - there are a million stories in the big city, and I don't want to be one of the ones who ends up in a bodybag somewhere... having said that, I do extend a certain measure of trust to people I meet randomly - but I try to be sensible about it.

You can't live your life thinking that way. It's just madness. (Not implying that you do)

Fuck yeah. Life's too short.

Most of the time, I would love to try and find new people to befriend, but when it comes to actual face-to-face connections, I find it rather difficult to actually gather up the courage to actually come up to someone and introduce myself. Even when I'm interacting with someone in a semi-social setting (e.g. while I'm getting my hair cut) it really takes me a heck of a lot to try and be as friendly and "open" as I'd like to be. Sometimes I can succeed; after a lengthy period of working in service-oriented jobs, I always make an effort to be as friendly to anyone out there currently doing a service-oriented job (anyone from a fast food cashier to a convenience store clerk), and that works out well for me, but when I'm just surrounded by strangers in general, my natural impulse is to be mute and not look anyone straight in the eye.

I, still to this day, have a much more difficult time interacting with males than I do with females. I suppose it's due to my automatic assumption that, following the trend laid out throughout grade school and high school (and even a bit beyond), the male isn't going to want to be seen in public talking to me, so "Why bother?" I scrutinize males a lot more than I do females and feel that I have to remain more guarded in the presence of males since I assume that if I let my guard down I'd subject myself to all manner of horrible behavior "again". I realize this all seems highly unfair, but very few males in my life have done me right, and one of them passed away last year.

On the other hand, in the context of the Internet (e.g. message boards and AIM), it's much easier for me to loosen up and open myself to social experiences. Perhaps it's because of the relative anonymity of it all, or perhaps it's just due to my having far greater ease with being able to express myself in a written manner than it is for me to do in an oral manner. Though there are those times that, even when talking about an online context, I find myself feeling distrustful again and feel the reappearance of this invisible fortress I build for myself to try to protect against hurt. Only a handful of people out there, both online and offline, never trigger my alarms, and they already know who they are.

Trust me, I hate being like this, but I feel like I'd hate it even more if I relegated myself to the doormat punching bag position I filled for those crucial first several years of my "socializing" life, so the fortresses keep on popping up and I keep on trying to remain vigilant and proactive, both online and offline. (Though it's getting really tiring.)

So I guess I can be outgoing, but it takes effort, and just doesn't seem worth it, or I'm just too tired, a lot of the time. I still manage to be outgoing enough to have some great friends, and various cool acquaintances to talk to, so I suppose it works out okay.

x-post ha ha ha!

Corndoggery and horndoggery are not the same thing, are they?

Maybe I can't imagine a scenario where there is a friendship between a girl and a guy free from sexual tension.

(I'm hoping I'm using the "xpost" correctly: man, so much in-group terminology to learn...)

Why not the girl?

Bit of a derail, though, and overall I agree with Colette, there are a lot of times when I’ve wanted to spend time with a new friend in a platonic way just because they’re new and fun and haven’t heard my "80’s children’s cartoons" riff twenty times….

I think it depends on what you say to them.. i mean, I'm never shy of talking to someone on the tube if there's a reason to talk, like tube breaks down haha isn't it shit etc - ok normal vs. randomly tapping someone on the shoulder to talk about last night's telly - nutter

Yeh, I know that feeling. I get a bit frustrated if my group of friends is unwilling to even TRY accepting someone new into our fold or whatever

ilx to thread ;)))) (kidding)

LOL

But I'm saying a "friendcrush" whereby the two parties hang out with each other all the time and practically act like a couple would probably end with the guy getting the wrong impression.

in the examples i was thinking of when i mentioned guys that have them, one was a guy-->girl. i don't think he actually fancied her, except her voice. but he was so excited whenever he ran into her on campus. not a real crush.

next two were both a guy friend of mine that got very excited about meeting friends of mine. guy friends. one ended up moving in with them (not in *that* way), the other was kind of admired from afar and he got excited whenever they met.

but all those examples are guys with friendcrushes, some on girls, that weren't sexual at all.

of course, sometimes there's an element of tension in guy/girl friendships. why else does 'when harry met sally' resonate so well? but i think that there's plenty of situations where friendcrushes happen with no tension at all

(sidenote: for me, a real friendcrush is somewhat rare. i would be surprised if there was more than a couple a year, if that)

loads of xposts

only to certain extents... i guess for me i don't behave differently to male or female AS SUCH, but more on a personal level i'd know what each person likes/dislike talking about. most of the time i like talking about hair and generally boys get very bored when i do.

Oh, and call me Simon or Si, as long as there isn't already one around these parts!

just got an email from a friend of a friend, who is one of those charming people that pulls ALL the time, and is friendly with everyone. i suggested he run a course for people that aren't quite as friendly or comfortable meeting new people, and he told me that i should just keep being the girl that pouts in the corner, it's 'endearing'.

gah, i suck.

Club FT, THURSDAY 26th August, with exciting special guests!!

and we now have a festivities calender at http://my.calendars.net/ilxfap yay!

he doesn't sound all that friendly there.

and i don't pout! much.

ah, thanks simon, i hope you had fun. i can actually be quite manic when i'm the host-- but that feels like it's a 'job' rather than being social.

xpost to ken-- LOL

Why not? People should do more of this really. How many dull journeys have you been on that could be speeded up with a random conversation? After all we all post on ILX all day speaking to relative strangers about the most inane shit we could possibly think. If we were all in the same train carriage to work every single day, do you think we'd even bother? I doubt it - at least until the train got delayed or something.
Of course there are times when, for instance if I'm really tired on my way to work and would rather not hear someone's incessant prattle about the footie. In a perfect world we'd all carry around cards for this kind of situation with "SHUT UP, I DON'T WANT TO KNOW" written on them, then one could strike up a conversation with any stranger who wasn't flashing theirs.
It's a shame though. I think when the world was less populated and there was less rushing around people did stop to say hello. Even in Paris I've noticed it's quite common to say "Bonjour Madam/Monsieur" to someone you pass in the street - especially if you pass them every day on your way to work for instance.
The British are the worst though. For all their so-called politeness and stiff-upper-lippedness they come off worse at the end of the day because they're so isolated from one another. An Englishman will not approach his fellow man unless he requires something from him. If you see Spanish, Greek or Italian people dancing you'll find they dance a lot closer together, more sensually. There'll be mixed gender dancing and strangers will dance close to each other with little social stigmas of "oh I can't dance with them because I don't know them". The British won't even speak to each other let alone dance face to face.
What's even more amusing is if you witness a Brit and a Mediterannean person speaking in a room. The Med will literally walk the Brit around the room, moving in closer and closer whereas the Brit will be in constant defence backing him/herself into walls in order to avoid being in such close quarters.
It's incredible how we've let ourselves get so repressed we feel awkward just asking someone the time of day or having strangers engage in trivial conversation. We always think that there's an ulterior motive: "Why's this guy talking to me? Is he a nutter? Is he going to follow me off the bus and throw me into an alley?"

Right I've lost track of myself now, but I hope you know what I'm saying.

fuck's sake.

if the train journey was three months long i'd probably lurk for the first month and if there's already a banter going on about bukakke or something i'd probably join in yeah!

I think you'll find most people are like that, and not just in London.

i tend to read on tube/bus though, so is probably a different form of escapism. i like journeys for this reason

exaclty - there are many ways to express disinterest. But in London and other large cities talking to new people is not the done thing. And sure, there's a lot of room to be selective about the people you choose to speak to but what if they don't want to talk? What do you do then?

I spend my time reading on public transport.

haha x-post

I'm usually reading or listening to music on public transport these days so tend to filter out everyone around me anyway.

I never chat to people during journeys but I sometimes have a little banter with people on the street tho usually not through my own engineering. These days I find London a lot less hostile than I used to (living as I did further out).

right that's it, i am never leaving my house ever again

1. That we are all a bit creepy deep down and if I really wanted to avoid potential psychopaths I should stay off ILX first and foremost.
2. That if we weren't so hung up on our own personal inhibitions and protective about our privacy and personal space we might actually be a lot happier.

If you really, truly, don't like people then shut yourself away in your cave, and don't freaking talk to them ESPECIALLY TO DO NOTHING BUT RANT ON ABOUT HOW MUCH YOU HATE THEM.

If you dislike something or someone, avoid it or them. Including us.

This is off-topic I think, but bear with me

There's a guy who walks round our town - an alcoholic (one of many). He comes into the shop quite often and is normally quite respectful (though incoherent) - I have heard stories where he has gone over the top though. But you can tell that this guy wasn't always like this - he has friends and probably once a family. Still on Friday nights I see gangs of Burton's menswear fucking casuals walking past and yelling at him, scallies and shellies winding him up, he gets pushed around and chastised by everyone in town. I often wonder who's being the most unreasonable.

Anyway, he walked into the shop and he was polite, talked a little rubbish at us, shook my hand, bought beer, even said thank you and left.
"Aw," I said - "I feel sorry for that poor guy".
"You're the only one" said my co-worker.
Why is this? The poor bloke has a disease and can't help what he does. The only time I've seen him "cause trouble" or act aggressive is when he's been provoked by other "normal" people. And then everyone scowls and points at him, then they jeer and laugh and then worse. No wonder he gets wound up, no wonder he has to drink to stay abrink.

It's the same in the bigger cities - distrust breeds distrust.

go on the internet

Marcello, you were saying how lonely and helpless you were feeling the other day on another thread. I don't want to be a cunt but it's very hard to empathise when you say things like this.

Screw you lot. I'm off to lunch.

steve the N29 is GOLD for drunken nutters!! i love it.

I quite often talk to ppl on the bus but they are nearly always colleagues. Sometimes I don't know them very well. Some of them I never see at any other time. But I recognise that they are ppl from my company and start talking, or they'll start talking to me. This is of course linked to working for a quite big company in a very small city. There are only about 4 bus routes that it is possible to take from where I work, so there'll nearly always be at least a couple of ppl from the company that i know on the bus at any one time and maybe a couple of temps whom i find are working for us when they get off the bus. Quite different from london when there may be well over a dozen bus routes from any one workplace and the chances of randonly travelling home with a colleague being more limited by simple math.

Really, really unjustified, especially *now*.

1. Attractive women

2. Everybody else

It's a tough choice

For the last two months I've tried to talk to you. And I speak as someone who at one time was virtually the only defender you had on these boards. But instead you have chosen either to ignore me deliberately or make oblique comments on the boards about me. You have studiously ignored the three emails I sent you inviting you to meet up with me as a gesture of friendship, as well as numerous similar words on these boards, presumably because you thought "I'm single again, therefore he's trying it again." Wrong.

So let's get rid of any ambiguity about this, shall we? I am not, have never been and will never be interested in having a relationship with you (if I were indeed "trying it," I would have been a lot less subtle). And you know why? Because you have no idea what it takes to form and maintain a relationship. You keep saying that you want someone to love you, but you have no love to give in return, because whatever resources of love you might have are entirely expended on the profound and passionate love you have for yourself. You are incapable of reading or understanding the feelings and thoughts of anyone else because you are so wrapped up in your own, smug SELF, SELF, SELF that the wrapping forms a protective barrier to ward off anyone stupid enough to want to come into contact with you. You have no concept of love or beauty. Why don't you try and take a good look at why Joe dropped you? Perhaps he was driven to sleep with someone else as a relief from having to put up with your ceaseless egocentric self-trumpeting.

And coupled with your immense ego is its inverted twin, anaemically low self-esteem, which you can use as a weapon, because you construct such ridiculously high standards for anyone who wants to be your partner or friend, standards which no one could ever hope to meet, let alone match, that when the inevitable happens and your friends and partners are driven away, you can console yourself with the dual thoughts: "he just wasn't good enough" and "i'm just not good enough." It works both ways.

Or maybe the question is: do you want friends or just a retinue of servants who'll mutely agree with everything you say and think? Do you want to be loved, or just honoured and obeyed?

And it's also crystal clear that you haven't learned any lessons from the last 12 months, because that's when the broken needle starts sticking - "...dirty dronerock boys (click) dirty dronerock boys (click)..." You're never going to get to sleep with Jason Pierce or John Taylor or Alex James, Kate, just get used to it.

Because I can visualise you now, at the age of fifty, still munching from your pizza cartons in your bedsit, still going to clubs and being laughed at by "boys" half your age. And when that time comes - and believe me it will, and maybe a long time before you hit fifty - you'll think to yourself: "I had a gift and I could have used it for good...but instead I used it to destroy." I just feel sorry for you, Kate, all I feel for you is pity.

OK, enough. Even writing this has been extremely depressing. So let's just agree to carry on as we have been, in other words let's just talk amongst our respective selves and ignore each other.

Have a nice life, which you won't. Bye.

But I've decided that it really truly should be left there, both to remind me of all the reasons that Marcello and I fell out in the first place - so I'm never, ever tempted to reinitiate a "friendship" no matter how many pathetic little emails he sends privately to my inbox while publicly mocking and attacking myself and my friends and turning a community I love into his private warzone.

And secondly, as mirror image of projection for Marcello to look into, when he wonders why he is alone and embittered.

I don't like you, Marcello. I don't like the way you treat other people, or this board. I've tried being nice to you, I've tried ignoring you. I want no part of your world, or the emotional vampirism that you call "friendship". LEAVE. ME. ALONE. And leave my friends alone.

Kay? Thanks, bye.

x-post

Doctors should wash their hair (and their ties) frequently, if they are to perform surgery upon me, thanks.

yeah it's kinda cool

Get better at it all the time

it depends who they are

i generally like to jettison some of the old ones first

Meeting new people isn't so bad. Just meeting someone doesn't imply a commitment to keeping up any future relationship. As a dyed-in-the-wool introvert, I can be as sociable as the next person for a few minutes at a time, but keeping up with close relationships is restricted to a very select few.