The Phantom Menace: What The Hell is Wrong With It?

Having gotten the DVD recently -- yeah, it is pretty good. There's some fun subtle detail in the acting that gets overlooked because everyone's beating up on Jar Jar. Which perhaps was inevitable. ;-)

the complete lack of character development...the points-on-a-line plot...the paper-thin justifications for plot points/development...the wooden acting...the crassness of truncation (knowing that it is merely one part of a trilogy)...the wink-wink knowingness of it alll...JAR-FUCKING-JAR...

this is not to say that the original trilogy didn't suffer from these factors either...(pauline kael rightly ripped it a new a-hole in a very prescient review where she saw it as the birth of a new roller- coaster-cinema...something which has certainly borne itself out to be true)...but this would be a shit-pile with or without the star wars brand name attached to it (worse with, only because it never would have seen the light of day otherwise)...

none of this will stop me from seeing episode 2, mind.

why are you in arizona, ally?

1. Jake Lloyd's acting. I know he's a kid, but even for a kid actor I thought it was pretty poor. 2. The Yippees. It's just a crap word. 3. Midicholrians. I don't care for the fact that the force is now more a medical condition that some mystical force. 5. Jar Jar, of course. He really didn't bother me the first time I saw it, but if you see it more than once it grates on your nerves.

Not that the trailers for Episode 2 didn't intrigue me. (Though Hayden's bitching about Obi Wan makes me think of Mark's Episode IV whining about Tattoonine, or whatever that stupid planet is called. George Lucas is a DOLT.)

He doesn't strike me as an improvement, I fail to see what's so special about him. As it is, a documentary bit on the DVD showed the other couple of actors up against Lloyd in the final screen test, and Lloyd made them both look terrible. That says something right there!

Apparently no one has invented guard rails in the Star Wars universe.

(Say what you will about cross generational romances, and I certainly don't have a problem with them, but if you knew them when they were eight, being precocious and saying yippee then frankly you a sicko). The rest of the film is kinda join the dot fun, but too much goes on at the end and the construction is Plot-Set Piece-Plot-Set Piece....

my Jar Jar Binks Sticky Tongue Toy is broken; now the extensible tongue lies limp in two pieces, one stuck to the wall, one still attached to Jar Jar.

Ally, did Liam have a bunch of porn movie charges on his bill?

All the dialogue in *every* Star Wars movie is superfluous. You're supposed to pay attention to the music and sounds. ;-)

But yeah, what the fuck, why do Jedis have so many pits in their ships? There's always a pit that they're dying in or getting destroyed by, c.f. that big pit into the ENTIRE CENTER OF THE DEATH STAR'S MAINFRAME (great design, dickheads) that they had to shoot into in E IV, the Cloud City endless tunnel that Luke falls into in Ep V, the big pit in the Death Star (AGAIN!!) that the Emperor gets tossed into in Ep VI (plus the pit Jabba wants to throw them all in), now this. Don't they learn their lessons about big unguarded pits?

I'm seeing this long-delayed thing tonight:

Plot:
"Star Wars" fans travel to Skywalker Ranch to steal an early copy of "Episode I: The Phantom Menace".

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0489049/

guys the lightsaber fights were cool

Billy Dee Williams ... Judge Reinhold

O_O

I assume that's a jokey "judge" name. O boy, can't wait (plus Shatner & Rogen cameos).

(& Carrie Fisher, Kevin Smith)

apparently all the funny people in this movie play guards

How much are you being paid to see this? xp

sounds almost worse than the Phantom Menace

xp: not even close to enough

really these movies are all kinda awful but this is the worst one

but Episode II was the one w/ the really hideous Portman-BoyVader mush in it.

episode III >>> episode II peaks >>>>> episode I >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> episode II valleys

The love scenes? Possibly the worst ever.

its kinda unbelievable how much I hate Star Wars now

I mean 8-yo me would be shocked and appalled

""I hate sand its rough and course and it gets in everywhere" - yeeeeesh...

I criticized Jake Lloyd upthread, but Hayden Christensen is terrible in these movies (though he was decent in Shattered Glass?).

everybody is terrible in these movies. Its an insult to movies everywhere to even call them "movies" at all.

yeah, I don't think Christensen is actually that bad of an actor, but Lucas's dialogue has a consistent knack of making the speaker look like they are delivering the lines at gunpoint.

And all of Anakin's dialogue is ridiculous...even in the context of these movies.

Lucas's dialogue has a consistent knack of making the speaker look like they are delivering the lines at gunpoint.

which somehow was a great effect in the o.g. movies

but all portentous lines in o.g. films were given to either a great old British knight or 3-ft high green puppet

Lucas didn't write Empire (really, the best of these by a wide margin) or Jedi and the dialogue in the original Star Wars is pretty damn clunky - the only reason it works is because he had good actors and didn't have the technical tools at his disposal to completely obliterate their input.

like, if he had been able to make Harrison Ford and Carrie Fisher and Alec Guinness shoot all their parts separately against a green-screen and then superimpose facial expressions from different takes onto their heads HE WOULD HAVE and the first one would've sucked.

alec guinness made that shit shakesperean

guys

the lightsaber fights are cool

no

yes

there was just more gritty 'space' stuff in the originals, menace suffers from all those paradise looking sets. even the land stuff in Empire was all snow blizzards and ice cold death.

I got the original trilogy on dvd recently and seeing them again for the first time in a few years really compounded what a fucked up job Lucas made of the prequels, in nearly every respect. I mean, there's some cool scenes and stuff scattered thinly through the prequels, but the overriding feeling I get is how little *fun* they are compared to the originals. And Teh Phantom Menace is the least fun of the lot.

yeah everything in the new movies is an infinite shiny vista out of Maxfield Parrish

x-post

Tattooine was pretty gritty.

morbz please tell me that at the end of fanboys they finally show the sick kid the movie and its fuckin awful and he's like why are you showing this to me

yeah it really is a tragic setup for a movie

morbz please tell me that at the end of fanboys they finally show the sick kid the movie and its fuckin awful and he's like why are you showing this to me

lolz for realz how could it end any other way

he should be all "you should have let me die"

also Tie fighters, X wings, Falcon, star destroyers, death star, at ats, at sts, speeder bikes, lukes hovercraft, jawas huge iron truck, and rebel fleet ships ..

ALL better than crappy chrome-smooth-no-character-at-all ship, and pod racers.

he should be all "you should have let me die"

then they watch Terms of Endearment, everybody hugs, the end

yup basically the argument for the antique future vs. the flat-pack veneer future (yes I know none of these take place in "the future")

that shit made alec guinness filthy rich

clearly the heartwarming ending will be the kid seeing how shitty phantom menace is and realizing that friendship is more important that star wars

http://www.mullsports.com/images/EMPIRE.jpg

ie AWESOME

I don't think the problem is that nu-Star Wars looks too sleek and shiny and neat, its that it looks cluttered and fussy and irritatingly over-done. I guess yeah things don't look as dirty or clunky, but there's just way more CRAP in every single goddamn frame. Its too busy.

yup basically the argument for the antique future vs. the flat-pack veneer future (yes I know none of these take place in "the future")

― TOMBOT, Thursday, January 22, 2009 4:23 PM (15 minutes ago)

i dunno i kinda like that the old republic had a kind of fifties gleam while the empire and rebellion were all about blocky functionality

boy am i sick of even thinking about the 'problems of star wars' tho

Why was Liam Neeson calling Ally again?

lol

morbz report plz

EMBARGOED

(lets just say it doesn't live up to Episode I. last line in the movie is the best)

What about the new one where he whoops the ass of some kidnappers? Anyone curious (I am, but only barely. Less so than with Paul Blart, for ex.)

I'm having a hard time guessing what could make a movie worse than Episode I

Jar Jar's three identical nephews.

xxp: how about grossout comedy + CANCER

cancer? that's hilaaaaaaarious
http://www.tvsquad.com/media/2006/07/jerri.jpg

http://i218.photobucket.com/albums/cc259/ericrider/CancerBoyWhistling.jpg

not TOP-SHELF comedy

Cancer-boy = A++

ANAKIN and PADMÉ stop at the balustrade. PADMÉ looks out
across the garden to the shimmering lake and the mountains
rising beyond. ANAKIN looks at her.

PADMÉ: When I was in Level Three, we used to come here for
school retreat. See that island? We used to swim there
every day. I love the water.

ANAKIN: I do too. I guess it comes from growing up on a
desert planet.

PADMÉ becomes aware that ANAKIN is looking at her.

PADMÉ: ...We used to lie on the sand and let the sun dry
us... and try to guess the names of the birds singing.

ANAKIN: I don't like sand. It's coarse and rough and
irritating, and it gets everywhere. Not like here. Here
everything's soft... and smooth...

He touches her arm. PADMÉ has become receptive to the way
he looks at her but is nervous.

PADMÉ: There was a very old man who lived on the island. He
used to make glass out of sand - and vases and necklaces
out of the glass. They were magical.

ANAKIN: (looks into her eyes) Everything here is magical.

PADMÉ: You could look into the glass and see the water. The
way it ripples and moves. It looked so real... but it
wasn't.

ANAKIN: Sometimes, when you believe something to be real,
it becomes real.

They look into each other's eyes.

PADMÉ: I used to think if you looked too deeply into glass,
you would lose yourself.

ANAKIN: I think it's true...

ANAKIN kisses PADMÉ. She doesn't resist. She comes to her
senses and pulls away.

PADMÉ: No, I shouldn't have done that.

ANAKIN: I'm sorry. When I'm around you, my mind is no
longer my own.

He looks at her.

...

EXTERIOR: NABOO, MOUNTAIN MEADOW - LATE AFTERNOON

PADMÉ and ANAKIN are in the middle of an idyllic hilly
meadow, its lush grasses sprinkled with flowers. At a
distance, a herd of SHAAKS graze contentedly.

Beyond is the shimmering expanse of the lake. Several other
lakes stretch to the horizon. The warm air is full of
little floating puffballs. They sit on the grass, in a
playful, coy mood, talking. PADMÉ is picking flowers.

PADMÉ: I don't know...

ANAKIN: Sure you do... you just don't want to tell me.

PADMÉ: Are you going to use one of your Jedi mind tricks on
me?

ANAKIN: They only work on the weak-minded. You are anything
but weak-minded.

PADMÉ: All right... I was twelve. His name was Palo. We
were both in the Legislative Youth Program. He was a few
years older then I... very cute... dark curly hair...
dreamy eyes.

ANAKIN: All right, I get the picture... whatever happened
to him?

PADMÉ: I went into public service. He went on to become an
artist.

ANAKIN: Maybe he was the smart one.

PADMÉ: You really don't like politicians, do you?

ANAKIN: I like two or three, but I'm not really sure about
one of them. (smiling) I don't think the system works.

PADMÉ: How would you have it work?

ANAKIN: We need a system where the politicians sit down and
discuss the problem, agree what's in the best interests of
all the people, and then do it.

PADMÉ: That is exactly what we do. The trouble is that
people don't always agree. In fact, they hardly ever do.

ANAKIN: Then they should be made to.

PADMÉ: By whom? Who's going to make them?

ANAKIN: I don't know. Someone.

PADMÉ: You?

ANAKIN: Of course not me.

PADMÉ: But someone.

ANAKIN: Someone wise.

PADMÉ: That sounds an awful lot like a dictatorship to me.

A mischievous little grin creeps across his face.

ANAKIN: Well, if it works...

PADMÉ stares at ANAKIN. He looks back at her, straight
faced, but can't hold back a smile.

PADMÉ: You're making fun of me!

ANAKIN: (sarcastic) Oh no, I'd be much too frightened to
tease a Senator.

PADMÉ: You're so bad!

PADMÉ picks up a piece of fruit and throws it at him. He
catches it. PADMÉ throws two more pieces of fruit, and
ANAKIN catches them.

ANAKIN: You're always so serious.

PADMÉ: I'm so serious?!

ANAKIN then starts to juggle the fruit. PADMÉ laughs and
throws more fruit at him. He manages to juggle them too
until there are too many, and he loses control and ducks,
letting food fall on his head. They both laugh.

ANAKIN stands in front of a SHAAK, yelling at it and waving
his arms. PADMÉ starts laughing as ANAKIN runs in circles,
chased by the SHAAK.

...

A fire blazes in the open hearth. PADMÉ and ANAKIN are
sitting in front of it, gazing into the flames. She looks
up as ANAKIN leans in to kiss her.

PADMÉ: Anakin, no.

ANAKIN: From the moment I met you, all those years ago, a
day hasn't gone by when I haven't thought of you. And now
that I'm with you again, I'm in agony. The closer I get to
you, the worse it gets. The thought of not being with you
makes my stomach turn over - my mouth goes dry. I feel
dizzy. I can't breathe. I'm haunted by the kiss you should
never have given me. My heart is beating, hoping that kiss
will not become a scar. You are in my very soul, tormenting
me. What can I do? I will do anything you ask...

Silence. The logs flame in the hearth. PADMÉ meets his eye,
then looks away.

ANAKIN: If you are suffering as much as I am, tell me.

(Cue smartass comment from joker in the theater)

oh god that is worse than I remember

"kiss me like you did on Nabooooo!" always gets a laugh from the wife

he logs flame in the hearth

ANAKIN then starts to juggle the fruit. PADMÉ laughs and
throws more fruit at him. He manages to juggle them too
until there are too many, and he loses control and ducks,
letting food fall on his head. They both laugh.

ANAKIN stands in front of a SHAAK, yelling at it and waving
his arms. PADMÉ starts laughing as ANAKIN runs in circles,
chased by the SHAAK.

^^^the true legacy of star wars

We were both in the Legislative Youth Program. He was a few years older then I... very cute... dark curly hair...dreamy eyes.

The Legislative Youth Program was located in the Mark Foley School of Public Morality.

when i saw ep 2 it was like this glorious comedy masterpiece that everyone was attending with the foreknowledge that it would be a camp classic - shot of portman in some crazy leather bustier sitting by a fireplace was str8 up like janet leigh lounging around in her undies in 'touch of evil'

except that Janet Leigh was hot and Natalie Portman is kinda gross

heh. kill youre saelf.

Shakey ridiculously OFFTM

as weak as as they are i've found things to like in the other prequels, but phantom menace is just embarrassing.

Yep. What compounded the embarrassment was that it was the prequel that had TONS of hype and anticipation preceding it. People standing in lines all day, television crews, people clapping at the introductory text, everything. Then, in my case, a few days stretching into weeks of delusion where I wouldn't let myself acknowledge the disappointment. Then several years of distance, and a reviewing. Finally, acceptance.

And somehow George Lucas ending up making another few bajillion dollars off of it anyway.

(not that the other two prequels didn't have their fair share of hype and anticipation, but after the debacle of the first one, the excitement tempered)

I will say Fanboys has a great Harrison Ford joke in it

except that Janet Leigh was hot and Natalie Portman is kinda gross

― Courtney Love's Jew Loan Officer (Shakey Mo Collier)

Most wrong thing ever.

Janet Leigh was lovely:

http://wileywiggins.blogspot.com/10039335.jpg

(Though that top/brassiere situation is a little unfortunate, in a conical way.)

yeah, i'm not saying anything against Janet Leigh but Portman is not "gross".

Wow at that Janet Leigh pic (though 50s spikey boobs freak me out a bit).

The prequels did a lot to diminish the idea of the mythical Old Republic. In my head it was the ultimate utopia full of unimaginable wonders and limitless prosperity, closer to Iain Banks' Culture than a ultra-shiney Blade Runner rip-off.

hello janet leigh

i remember being 13 and defending episode 1 with "it totally had a plot!!"

ANAKIN then starts to juggle the fruit. PADMÉ laughs and
throws more fruit at him. He manages to juggle them too
until there are too many, and he loses control and ducks,
letting food fall on his head. Cheetah does a backflip. They both laugh.

ANAKIN then starts to juggle the fruit. PADMÉ laughs and
throws more fruit at him. He manages to juggle them too
until there are too many

speaking as a juggler, this scene is highly implausible. juggling starts with three and four is too many for most people (i doubt jedi padawans have much time off to practice circus skills).

I'm going to prefix everything I say from now on with "Speaking as a juggler..."

it always gets me the ladeez and the $$$

Speaking as a juggler, I find that highly unlikely.

First moment in watching this I knew something was wrong was when they had the aliens speaking English, not some weird made-up alien language with subtitles.

I think Jar Jar being in here is convenient because you can so O NO HE RUINED STAR WARS but I recently watched The Phantom Edit with all the Jar Jar scenes cut and it still kinda sucked.

The "extra scenes" on the DVD for this movie are so fucking painfully terrible that they become really hilarious high-camp- Anakin does a visit to Padme's house to meet Mom and hang out, do dishes etc. There are these scenes of them sitting in her bedroom looking at photos of her on a charity mission to an alien planet and both of them talking about the poor aliens that were exterminated soon after the photo was taken that George Lucas probably thought were really moving or something = comedy gold!

That was in Episode 2

The original movies were kind of goofy and had the same squirrely qualities as a kid playing in a sandbox with really big action toys. Pow! Zing! Pow! Wheeee! It was this spirit that charmed adults and captivated kids. It was imaginative play, like a well-made sundae.

The Phantom Menace just about has all the fun pounded out of it by the desire to get it all under strict and detailed control. Jar-Jar was offered up as the officially-approved "element of childlike fun", as conceived by a committee worried about licensing royalties and fast-food tie-ins. Kids are easily manipulatde enough that they still liked the movie, but Lucas didn't exactly charm any adults with TPM.

I realize what I said there isn't exactly new. But it seems to sum it up about right to me.

Wait, didn't the original movies pretty much invent the action figure happy meal tie-in spectacle? Every now and then I'll come across an article about how revolutionary the movies were from a cross-marketing perspective. Like pre-star wars, toy tie-ins were afterthoughts, rise of Kenner, branded toothbrushes, etc, paving the way for Reese's Pieces in ET. Anyone working in marketing at the time -- can you confirm the revelatory impact in your field? Ewoks, I mean.

Basically it all boils down to first three films have charm, the others don't.

Not to defend the juggling scene, but he is supposed to have the Force and stuff, it seems like being unnaturally good at juggling would go with that, no?

you're talking to a juggler, dude. show some respect.

WHY, jugglers!?

Speaking as a juggler, I find that very offensive.

speaking on behalf of my juggler brothers and sisters

I don't remember if they did this in the star wars movies, but jugglers, is it a professional pet peeve to see portrayals of juggling (particularly in animation) as sort of a clockwise or counter-clockwise circle instead of interlocking parabolas?

i never even bothered with episode two. I don't remember anything about episode one. in fact, the only things i remember about any of these was the very very end of episode three. really george lucas should have just shot like a 30 minute prequel to star wars and left it at that.

I don't remember if they did this in the star wars movies, but jugglers, is it a professional pet peeve to see portrayals of juggling (particularly in animation) as sort of a clockwise or counter-clockwise circle instead of interlocking parabolas?

Speaking as a shut-in aspie juggler, GODDAMN YES.

arf

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Juggling

the only good Jar Jar bit in this is when he says "Hallo boyos" to the collection of droids but that's more because it's R2 intro

WHY, jugglers!?

dahahahaha

http://cinesofa.files.wordpress.com/2007/10/2e2hvu8.jpg

nick swisher?

are there any photos of hipster musicians wearing Jar-Jar t-shirts yet?

http://cinesofa.files.wordpress.com/2007/10/2e2hvu8.jpg http://api.ning.com/files/M0jBx91fsYysrKzfpXQoyTohPB2nW1uBWqoXkbrrEnfq*k7O156zeVguxPyX*6JDoCVYeOTbZ*gHDoiG3BCvhtwKX1rTHO9f/BrianPeppers.jpg

tonight the role of christina aguilera will be played by padme amidala

Its kind of amazing now that Portman seems so unmercifully awful in these movies because she's been so damn good since then! Makes me wonder if Lucas wanted everyone to be wooden or wtf

http://www.buzzfeed.com/awesomer/catching-up-with-anakin-skywalker-cci

natalie portman has been good since then?

she has a great expression in the zack galifinakis "between 2 ferns" thing.

she was pretty lol in SNL

to answer the thread question, the eventual darth vader spends most of this film and the next two being called "annie"

little orphan annie

anniemaul

they should have just called him "anuses"

Arse Vader

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LtkM2JPcHPo

Here's a pretty authoritative take on what is wrong with the Phantom Menace:

Some guy named Mike from Milwaukee, WI put together a 70-minute video review discussing the many reasons why the movie was horrible. And this isn’t your usual fanboy rant, this is an epic, well-edited well-constructed piece of geek film criticism. In fact, the way I learned about the video was from Lost co-creator and Star Trek producer Damon Lindelof, who said “Your life is about to change. This is astounding film making. Watch ALL of it.”

Part 1 of 7:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FxKtZmQgxrI

It isn't as amazing as Lindelhof says, and it has some annoying moments, but I enjoyed this.

Technically I'm in the same zone, since a 70-minute review of the Phantom Menace isn't going to change my life, and anything that long is bound to have a few annoying moments, but let it be known that I loooooled left and right at this

If you watch it all the way through to the end (which I did laughing all the way) there's a great bit where he starts looking at behind-the-scenes stuff like Lucas and his producer watching the first rough cut and realizing they'd completely blown it, which is horrifying and fascinating at the same time. Everyone's frustrated, not in the 'it's been a really long project and a lot of work so we're understandably cranky' way, but frustrated in a 'this project is a fuckup of the first order and to compound the horror there's no way we can redeem it now'.

ya that was awesome, i LOVE the way he incorporated the BTS stuff—the thing about all GL's toadies laughing at his bad jokes was devastating. kind of actually made me want to watch the TPM special features

this finally reminds me of a michael moore doc

WOW. I <3 interweb

Haha, OK, just started watching this, but as soon as the sound rolled I was like, "Wait, this is narrated by Tony Clifton?"

watched "attack of the phantom" re-edit the other day---anyone else seen these?

I was rootin for the phantom edit dude, but he was not able to mine gold from turd. (valiant effort, though)

the kinda juvenile and dumb bits of that 70 minute review aside, he really nails it, especially at the end; eviscerating. Those clips of Lucas watching the rough cut are pretty great (are those on the dvd? why would Lucas even make that public?), as are the bits about how memorable the characters are, and that take down of the lame, soul-less light saber duels.

maybe 'no main character' is actually the best thing about the prequels? it's one huge cliche avoided by not focussing on a single heroic figure at least. a Han Solo equivalent was surely a bad omission from the prequels story but no major noble hero figure was quite low down on the film's problems (the characters were mostly not interesting enough tho yeh). It wouldn't have been good to just have someone going thru the same kind of situations Luke went/would go thru.

the only "kinds of situations" that would be necessarily similar would be those that, you know, take place in OUTER SPACE

also avoiding huge cliches is only a good thing if the product improves. in this case (space opera!), sticking to the cliched use of likable characters would have been a ~good choice~

this peaks with part 2

yeah and besides, a protagonist doesn't always have to be a heroic figure. Any of the major characters in this movie (Qui Gon, Anakin, Obi-Wan, Padme/Amidala, Palpatine) could've made a good protagonist if there was any sign of a character arc at work. xp

maybe 'no main character' is actually the best thing about the prequels? it's one huge cliche avoided by not focussing on a single heroic figure at least. a Han Solo equivalent was surely a bad omission from the prequels story but no major noble hero figure was quite low down on the film's problems (the characters were mostly not interesting enough tho yeh). It wouldn't have been good to just have someone going thru the same kind of situations Luke went/would go thru.

IMO, the biggest problem was the fact that the prequels lacked a Han Solo, who was the skeptic or the cynic for the series. That character is almost always helpful for the fantasy, sci-fi and horror genre because they're the person sharing the audience's initial doubt and reluctance to buy into silliness and absurdities.

There's a part of the audience that walks into Star Wars thinking "what is all this 'Force' crap?" and they have someone to relate to with Solo, who also acts like the world of Star Wars is silly and not worth his time, and his eventual conversion into belief is not only fun to watch but helps the audience buy into this world as well.

The problem is as much that Lucas spends all of the prequels hoping an obvious main character will emerge. Between Ben Kenobi, Samuel L. Jackson, the racist slapstick creature, natalie portman's midriff, queer guy gin, yoda, that really boring fella who was in jumpers with billy elliott- they all get treated with the importance of main characters but none have the personality of one. It may not have been cliche-busting but to have Obi-Wan as being a bit of a rogue ala Han Solo, or Yoda as some churchill type motherfucker or whatever LEADING the movies would have focussed the story and made it infinitely more interesting.

You guys are welcome to splice in Kenan from SNL as skeptical audience proxy. I will support your endeavor!

I could've explained my earlier post better. But anyway, by the time Han Solo had joined the cause and lost all of his initial badass space-pirate personality traits his character was pretty worthless and Harrison Ford was begging Lucas to have his character killed off in the third movie. The series was at its best in the beginning, when Solo provided a counter to everything else going on.

and he's the "skeptical audience proxy" in the sense that without Solo there is no one creating dramatic tension by being the voice of disbelief that the audience relates to and eventually wants to see won over. It's like when you're a kid, you're watching a scary movie and at the beginning one character says "I don't believe in ghosts! They're not real!" You kind of agree with that, but now you're really looking forward to seeing that character find out that he's wrong.

the problem with the movie is that everyone talks like they're on valium. there is not a spark of life in anyone. it's CRAZY to me! everything gets talked about in this casual monotone.

everyone likes to complain about the CGI but honestly none of that would matter if there were even just one or two moments of a shared joke, a laugh a smile, some kind of joy. it is just totally JOYLESS. cannot fathom wanting to watch attack of the clones after this.

alo i can testify that as a kid, the moment in each of the original star wars movies that i anticipated the hardest was any time somebody lit their lightsaber. it was a holy moment. it meant something very special was afoot. in phantom menace they just whip the shit out at a moment's notice, like twitchy security guards reaching their guns. what was that sound?? FSSSHZZZZZEEEOWNNNGGGGH. oh, it's just a cat. FSSSIP. tralala. like, way to totally demote the coolest thing about star wars.

i can't complain about more sabers man http://i.imgur.com/zi7hd.gif

I've always thought the coolest thing about star wars was the trade embargoes

racially stereotyped aliens a close second

haha apparently i have seen this before and weighed in on this thread about it. i have no memory of either of those things ever happening :/

haha before dave cool chimed in i had totally planned on a "welcome visitor from the past!" post

visually i really liked the bit at the start where you can see the lightsabers glowing thru the smoke which the protocol droid then steps thru.

i have not seen this since it came out and i never even bothered with the other two prequels but i feel like i gotta before i die

just watch the red letter media review. 60 minutes shorter, 60 times more entertaining.

any idea why GL put all that behind the scenes horrorshow stuff on the DVD as akm asks upthread? seems insane that it shows people sat about looking gutted after the first screenings.

maybe it rhymed with something.

tracer, have you seen this?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Ey3g6BmuTI

The Red Letter Media "reviews"/case-studies/film lectures are all great.

Yeah, agreed. The guy's really smart, despite the infantile humour.

Not intended as a slight on infantile humour there, BTW.

the infantile humor is not the spice, it's the glue.
well, it's also a spice.

what's with that guy's voice? is that a put-on?

i _think_ i've seen all three "prequels" but i can't be sure. i remember one where anakin becomes vader and screams NOOOOOOO in a frankenstein's monster type shot. which one is that?

in other words, damn these movies are forgettable.

the last one

the fact that I can't remember what it's called does suggest that yeah maybe they are forgettable

its revenge of the sith, but i always have to think about it for a second to make sure i dont say return

its like poetry it rhymes

I wanna say one of these has 'utility data' in the title.

Yeah, his voice is a character. He's the same Mike who does the Half in the Bage reviews.

I was watching Star Trek V the other day and realized that it's better than any of the prequels.

Also, Natalie Portman had the best hairdos sexiest accent in cinematic history.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-3532713/Star-Wars-Phantom-Menace-actor-Jake-Lloyd-diagnosed-schizophrenia.html?ito=social-facebook

:(. poor guy. no doubt the 10-month prison stint probably didn't help matters re: how he's feeling. his comments in the article also demonstrate how deleterious an experience Hollywood can be for anybody, much less a young child.

look at these funny opening posts

"Lloyd felt so much anger towards the George Lucas directed film that he destroyed all of his Star Wars memorabilia, and only reprised his role as Anakin for five video games."

the daily mail

yeah I noticed the five video games line - what cunts.

Wait, so a slave child with a slave mother is building a protocol droid. To help his mother around the admittedly surprisingly large slave house they have. With, one assumes, diplomatic matters and translating things?

it's almost like george lucas just wanted to shoehorn c3po in the movie and didn't really think through the logic of it all

alternatively, perhaps protocol droids are relatively cheap to build compared to other droids and anakin was being thrifty with his, uh, slave wages?

anakin wanted a droid to help around the house - he was a slave child with a slave mother building a slave droid, right? what's the status of droids in the star wars universe? like, if r2d2 decided he wanted to quit the rebellion and go off to be an actor or a construction contractor or a maths teacher would he be free to do so?

I liked the Auralnauts' take on it, casting the droid as tortured from its very creation for being borne without skin:

https://youtu.be/WSCm8yAxBr8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WSCm8yAxBr8

Turmoil has engulfed the Galactic Republic. The #taxation of trade routes to outlying star systems is in dispute.
Hoping to resolve the matter with a blockade of deadly battleships, the #greedy Trade Federation has stopped all shipping to the small planet of Naboo.
While the congress of the Republic endlessly debates this alarming chain of events, the Supreme #Chancellor has secretly dispatched two Jedi Knights, the guardians of peace and justice in the galaxy, to settle the conflict....

What I want to know is how the heck were folks on Naboo going
to get their Amazon deliveries on time if all shipping routes
were stopped?

The asgard

Who were Naboo's top recording artists

Gungan Sheik

Binks 182

Boss Nas

Mike Watto

Captain Panaka and Tennille

Amidala $ign

Gungan Sheik’s single “Hold Me (Like You Did On Naboo)” was a big hit

Dua Lipa

Jar Jars of Clay

Gungan Roses

Reel Bigger Fish

Better Call Maul

Jar Jars of Clay

― Guayaquil (eephus!), Friday, January 1, 2021 11:53 AM bookmarkflaglink

Gungan Roses

― Guayaquil (eephus!), Friday, January 1, 2021 11:53 AM bookmarkflaglink

Gold star

Sheev 6

(references possibly too obscure all around but)

Bibble Puppy

most watched video on nabootube is "Baby Shaak"

Rewatching this.

Wow it's rough. I remember thinking the CGI wasn't great at the time. Now there are whole sections that look so bad it confuses me about what I'm actually looking at.

Somewhere in here there is a good movie that could have been made, but the whole trade war scenario is confusing and hard to follow. It's hard to understand what is going on in this movie a lot of the time.

Jar Jar wears boot cut jeans

It was the style at the time

As someone who dislikes most action sequences, the half hour pod race which is at best tangential to the plot is the worst part of this shit film.

It feels like it was created to be a theme park ride

oh my god the pod race is so good wtf

I don't care about 99% of action sequences, so a really long action sequence which isn't important to the plot is one of the most "don't care" things possible for me

yeah but with a plot this bad anything is a welcome relief

also we learn so much about the character of Sebulba

Maybe the visually ugliest movie I've ever seen in theatres, or at least challenged only by Attack of the Clones. I can't imagine how they look now.

Lest I be accused of coming here only to shitpost, though, I will say that I really do admire those--including several students of mine, and numerous Letterboxd reviewers--who manage to find genuine art in the prequel trilogy. I am not one of you, but I am glad that you exist.

Attack of the Clones looks *way* worse, because it's shot on early digital cameras with lousy color and lousy dynamic range, plus Lucas had fully gone in on the Sky Captain "all green-screen all the time" approach, and the techniques barely existed for matching the lighting between the on-set elements and the CGI ones.

Yes, Attack Of The Clones is the worst of the prequels and one of the dullest cinema going experiences I've ever had.

I think prequel defenders have their heart in the right place - individual folly over franchise IP slop any day - but the actual films are a pain to sit through.

It feels like it was created to be a theme park ride

Star Wars Episode I: Racer is a 1999 racing video game developed and published by LucasArts. It is based on the podracing sequence in the film Star Wars: Episode I – The Phantom Menace.

The game was originally titled Star Wars: Podracer; however, the subtitle was changed to Episode I Racer when LucasArts learned that another company owned the trademark for games with "Pod" in the title.[12]

I like the idea of Lucas getting a bug up his butt to special-edition it again but with his lucasfilm team signed over to disney, he's forced to redo everything himself so it's popsicle sticks and tinfoil models on string with lucas making pew pew and vrooooooooooo sounds.

Hot take: The pod race is not the worst part of the film. It has stiff competition

i like the pod race because it's the only part with fun sound design

The worst part of the film is the whole film, all of it.

For someone who allegedly loved the editing and producing process above all elae, Lucas's editing choices are mind-bogglingly awful.

So much of this film is just characters standing around discussing at length the pros and cons of a particular course of action before inevitably deciding to take it regardless. Just get on with it!

Elsewhere there are very short scenes where all that happens is two characters introduce themselves to each other in a boring "Hello my name is Padmé, who are you? Well it is nice to meet you, goodbye" kind of way.

There's a very daft moment where we get a wipe-cut just so a droid can inform Nute Raygun (looool, the name) that they've captured the Queen and he can say "Ahhh victory!" before cutting away again. Why didn't they just show this happening instead? It might have made for a good action sequence, but no.

More than once in the film characters appear to be parting ways only to walk straight into the next scene and start talking again - often to reiterate what they just said in the last scene. It's like when you keep bumping into the same acquaintance again and again in the supermarket having made smalltalk the first time round.

There are some excruciating moments on Tatooine with Anakin's mother, where it sounds like the cast are reading their lines for the first time. No expression or naturalism, just a dry delivery with long beats between lines that give it a strangely inert, almost Lynchian vibe.

People beat on poor Jake Lloyd, but the poor kid really didn't have much to work with from the start. It really is so stilted and under-baked.

Apparently Lucas really wanted someone else to write or rewrite the script, but unlike on the precious films he had no real takers. He's great at world-building but a stronger writer at his side could have really brought this to life.

Qai Gon escaping from a lightsabre duel in the desert by just jumping very very high onto the starship's fuselage. Apparently Darth Maul can't do this but he can

Another hot take: Jar Jar isn't actually the worst thing in this film. But he is, again, terribly written. I really think people dunked on the actors too much and didn't go to the source of what was wrong with this film: That it is tremendously poorly scripted and edited, and that the cast weren't properly directed in any way

xp: Sith have an ideological problem with gaining high ground.

Also: Technology deciding it's not going to work for no real reason, so a character flips a bunch of switches, pulls a lever, and suddenly it works again. That's not how tech works

its weird to me how (at least in my memory) the voice performances of the cgi characters like jar jar, nute gunray, the alien who owns anakin, etc, are all more lively and energetic than the soporific nonperformances of the human actors. obviously the accents and characterizations are all crazy racist, but at least they're doing something. ppl who know the behind the scenes lore of this, did someone other than lucas direct the voice actors?

Why is Jar Jar Binks permitted to just hang around in Queen Amadala's chambers?

Why are there whole sections of this that read as though they're out of a complicated political thriller rather than a fun family sci-fantasy romp?

How is there still 45 minutes left of this film?

I don't think you can make a good movie out of this (fan editors have certainly tried!)
The complicated political thriller is a lot closer to the Lucas narrative core of "this is a republic in decay rescued by a sensible dictator" but y'know, not very thrilling.

Actor Liam Neeson praised Ahmed Best for his portrayal of Jar Jar: "I know a lot of fans and critics didn't like it. [Best] received a lot of criticism, to the point where it really hurt his career. And I have to say that when he was making that movie, with Best as Jar Jar Binks and with Ewan McGregor as young Obi-Wan Kenobi, he was probably one of the funniest and most talented guys I've ever worked with. I remember calling ... my old ex-agent ... and saying, 'Listen, I think I just worked with the new Eddie Murphy.' And I still believe it."[56][57]

I can see that. As a performance it's one of the more convincing ones. The character is annoying and hard to understand, but he does "pop" and is more memorable than much if the rest of the movie

Why are there whole sections of this that read as though they're out of a complicated political thriller rather than a fun family sci-fantasy romp?

The complicated political thriller bits are the parts people like! I appreciate the ambition but he's no Damiani.

God everything that's happened so far after the pod race and the short lightsabre desert duel has been straight-up just people talking without moving the plot on at all

Political thriller, fine. But as Philip Nunez said, it's bereft of thrills. Like watching a slow day in Parliament

I'm usually a big fan of people talking without moving the plot on at all, but not in this case.

this film is a chore a lot of the time but it's a respectably weird vision, as is AOTC (despite its worse flaws), and ROTS is actually good. the sequel trilogy made me gain more appreciation for Lucas just doing exactly what he wanted, and apparently taking no one's advice. having comparatively little in the way of terrible banter vs ep 7-9 was a plus imo.

i guess i like the fact that the story takes everything really, really seriously, the characters are aware they're in some universe-shifting moment and don't pause at key junctures to exchange dialogue that sounds like it was scraped off Kevin Feige's cutting room floor (unless i'm forgetting more moments like that than i remember.)

Yeah, they're good movies to support in principle - they just also happen to be unwatchable (the first two anyway, didn't bother with the third).

It’s fascinating to recall how I waited for each of these thinking “it’s going to be really great this time”, watched them in absolute dismay, then saddled up for “but the next one is going to be really great”. Phantom Menace was particularly memorable for everyone turning out in costume for a midnight premiere, the cheer that went up for the Star Wars logo, and the dead silence after the movie ended.

Thinking about where I heard Peter Serafinowicz talk about his experience as the voice of Darth Maul and the world premiere, and tracked it down. Premiere is towards the end but whole thing is kind of incredible

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t0wHqNi3x5M

TPM killed off my pre-teen obsession with this franchise; I remember being so excited, and leaving the theater with my father in silence. I watched a well-regarded fan edit a few years ago and the film still wasn't any good. Granted, I hadn't seen the original since it was in theaters, so perhaps I would have liked the edit better had I remembered more of the crap that was cut.