Yoga - CD/SD

Also, I want to try out pilates, which has been described to me as yoga inverted, all backwords with the breathing.

Some of it may have some health benefits, but I think it should be remembered that it wasn't primarily developed for health reasons (let alone keeping slim--check out the guts on some famous yogis).

There was a very good article about competing yoga schools in New York Magazine (2/2/98).

Comments I have made elsewhere re: Yoga.

I am not anti-yoga, but I don't think everyone's body is compatible with all asanas (sp?).

I do not stand on my head, nor do I do handstands. These things are okay when you are 30kg and bouncy (i.e. a child) but if poorly executed when 70kg and flab+flaccid+brittle (i.e. an adult) they are plain dodgy. Being inverted with minor risk rocks though! Like hanging or walking up walls with hands on the floor.

People who do Bikram yoga (in a 100F room!) are crazy. The head supposedly makes it easier to stretch, but i would die from dehydration and heat exhaustion if I ever tried it.

That is all.

I don't know, but they were weird.

I did my first Astanga class on Friday night - previously I'd done a couple of "power yoga" classes (hurt for 3xdays afterwards), 1x hatha class (snoozeville), 1xpilates class (ridiculous). I liked it! And the teacher is a foxxx. It is VERY popular! Bring on the trend!

The breathing, is a bit, wack.

I would like to talk to T about yoga!

I COULD BE IN THE PUB YOU KNOW I JUST CHOSE NOT TO

(today i walked for more than two hrs becuz i wanted to check out yarn shop. i'm completely bonkers.)

I moved on to a Hatha Flow class that was also pretty intense, but mostly manageable for me. I liked it a lot and got into fairly good shape.

But that was a long time ago. Now I just sit on my ass and eat fried food dipped in Ranch dressing.

The odd thing is that when I actually tried Ashtanga I liked it way more than Iyengar. So now it is practitioners of Bikram Yoga (TM) that I scoff at as trend.

I think kundalini sounds pretty intense! The breath control appeals to me for singing reasons. There's a studio 2 minutes from my house that has a donation-based class, but despite those two compelling reasons I've not gone because fuck if I'm going to chant IN ENGLISH with a roomfulla flakes! (in this class they make you chant in Sanskrit and English). See, my heart is too calcified for such a discipline!

Pilates to thread!

-- Graham (graham), Thursday, 19 September 2002 11:24 (5 years ago)

oh ffs.

HELP!

ARRRRRRRRRR

oh sorry

Pirates?

Sheesh.

hehe

yoga is classic but there is a lot of super dud yoga out there that i wldn't even call yoga

it puzzles me when people are like, "i want to try yoga but i don't want to do funny breathing or chanting, or do any meditation. " in that case, you probably just want a sculpt & tone class.

otm omg

Meditation is a tool of Satan, BEWARE, BEWARE!!

is BEWARE BEWARE your mantra?

Just kidding. But I remember some lovely alarmist rabidly Christian fiction series that posited that Satan and his minions would try to get meditation and "spirit guide" programs into schools as a front for possessing our children if we didn't surround them with the protection of Jesus' blood.

Which is just to say that there's a lot of misconception and um...probably unnecessary concerns about some elements of yoga.

i want to take ballet

do they have beginning ballet classes for adults??

I'm sure someone does.

i thought if i entered a question in this box, the internet would tell me

We are all the internet.

I don't know the answer to the thread's question, but let me say that I love that Namaste Yoga they show over-and-over on the Fit TV channel. It's like the old 20-Minute Workout on HBO in cable's early days. Hott.

Satan and his minions would try to get meditation and "spirit guide" programs into schools as a front for possessing our children if we didn't surround them with the protection of Jesus' blood.

This is actually true.

My girlfriend is doing some yoga right now to an instructional tape, and she doesn't think any of my jokes are funny, especially the ones about "The circle of life" and how good it is, and the fart noises.

Yoginis are notoriously humor-imparied. Yogis, however...

http://www.johnrozum.com/images/yogibear.jpg

i want to take ballet

do they have beginning ballet classes for adults??

-- Tracer Hand, Tuesday, February 12, 2008 11:37 AM (1 week ago) Bookmark Link

i was wondering the same thing actually!

touch my forehead to my shin, you've got to be kidding me.

i have never even been able to touch my toes!

my back just doesn't do forward bends. or maybe it is my hamstrings. it makes me feel like a goon.

years of yoga and I still could not touch my toes.

yoga is shite.

ppl can't touch their toes?

*pbl can't touch their toes

(*pobbles)

yeah i can't touch my toes. i have never been able to. i have long legs, maybe that is why.

I started doing yoga a couple months ago. Very relaxing.

yeah, i think it might have more to do w/ legs vs. torso+arms than flexibility

They played LCD Soundsystem and MGMT in my yoga class the other day. Surprisingly ok.

Felicity where do you go?

This is to be my Big Summer Of Yoga

Crunch LA.

i am going to be doing 1hr in mornings 3 consecutive times a week throughout all of june!

bell_labs you will be able to touch your toes soon enough, i'm sure of it. even if you've got back pain. it does take time though - you kind of have to have patience with yoga. or it teaches you patience with self. i don't know, i do the kind of yoga that doesn't feed my competitive drive, and therefore lets me chill out - b/c i mean, there are plenty of other arenas in life where that drive is engaged. anyway, i have pretty tight hamstrings etc and at first found it super painful to try to touch my toes, but after about two years of regular practice i can put both hands flat on the ground w/o pain, once warmed up.

i feel like finding a good teacher and a good set of people in the class is kind of the first challenge! but i am v picky that way

yeah i'm not taking a class, just doing dvds. at least for now! maybe once i get a little more flexible i will be less intimidated by classes.

i started doing 10-15 mins of yoga before i run or play basketball last fall - at first id have to get warm to barely touch my toes now i can put my palm flat to the floor!

doing this workout 2x week, makes me rly tired afterward, following day i feel 5 years younger. other days i stretch, cardio/circuit, drink beer. in that order.

jesus 90 minutes?

that's how long my class was.

I sleep a lot better on days I do yoga. 90 minutes seems like a long time.

My clases are 60 or 90 minutes.

90 minutes is great in the evenings ending with a long Shivasina under a blanket or towel. Ahhh.

lauren, are you doing yoga anywhere I know? ;)

i'm bad about trying new classes, f. i'm SO self-conscious. so for classes, i've stuck to my old standby (kusala).

and yes, long class followed by a rest under the blanket is awesome.

haha btwn this and the talk on beauty/etc thread abt being wrapped up in blankets at a spa, i've realized how much i hate being wrapped up in blankets or being under a blanket in a public(ish) space! so not relaxing to me. weird realizations file.

(roughly) 45 minutes of moving asanas followed by 20 minutes of balance poses, 20 minutes of yoga for your abs, then 10 or so minutes of chillaxin in child's pose variants.

the length was intimidating but the 1st half is definitely the most challenging part for me. once that parts over i really enjoy the focus on breath control and slowly increasing my range of movement.

now i just gotta do this twice a week until i'm 80. easy part.

Yeah, it makes me feel like I'm stuck in an envelope! Always hated kindergarten enforced naptime.

xp

where can you buy the video for that?

felicity, you should try Brock's class at Yogaworks in westwood. It's full of flyers, which can be, um, a challenge to yr ego if yr not one, but also the best vinyasa class east of Venice (where Vinnie Marino still reigns supreme). Towel or mysore rug required.

....flyers?

i don't want to think about what a yoga class in westwood is like. the scene at my bf's nephew's kiddie karate class was scarring enough.

i'm finding rmexico's post completely o_O/LA

i also don't know what a flyer is!

Anywhere further east of Venice?

Am I a flyer?

dunno - do you effortlessly lift into handstands mid-vinyasa? do you look forward to jump-throughs? would you describe a bakasana>handstand>eka pada kundinyasana sequence as "really centering"? then You Might Be a flyer...

There are any number of good flow (and non-flow) classes and teachers in the hoillywoo/silverlake/downtown area. I'm just a sucker for vinyasa in a hot room. It's the difference between a bowl and a brownie.

Cool, thanks. I do want to try the free Sunrise/Sunset Runyon Canyon yoga, too.

i'm finding rmexico's post completely o_O/LA

Totally OTM, by the way, but LA's like that. Ground Zero for yoga in the US and home base for 80% of the Yoga Industry's superstars (for better and for worse).

The idea of any form of exercise having superstars is mindblowing to me.

Oh wait. I forgot about the Olympics.

haha yeah, but i love california for it anyway, even if i find a lot of it kinda o_O
xpost lol supastar yoga exactly... but it's been going on since the 70s on the west coast!
i've done a bunch of anusara yoga, which is US-based, tho maybe not california (maybe arizona or even texas), and there's something about it that doesn't quite gel with me. and something that does. anyway... i actually don't even know if there's a 'formal' name for the kind of yoga i've been doing with my current teacher. i mean, i keep forgetting it and forgetting to ask. it's nice though.

Anusara = John Friend = Texas, north of Houston in one of those creepy newfangled New Urban-type places: http://www.thewoodlands.com/

I find the language a little fruity, but the practice itself really good - the focus and attention to detail of Iyengar without the severity, and notwithstanding the absurdities the actual Anusara teachers I've known have almost without exception been really excellent.

It's also a perfect complement to the flow stuff, where Warrior IIs have a tendency to get pretty sloppy as folks struggle to keep up. Without a foundational alignment-based practice it's just calisthenics, people.

/yoga nazi

(note: many astanga types will openly smirk at Anusara types; many serious Anusara types turn out to be ex-astangis... it's a funny little world. in my limited experience it takes about six months with any practice before you "get" what it's about, and much like sports clichés and 12-step mantras there are things that seem silly at first but reveal hidden depths in practice)

PS felicity if yr going to Crunch check out Donovan's class if you can. I've never had him as a teacher but he's a genuinely great guy and sure SEEMS like he'd be an equally great teacher. If you make it tell him Jake said hello and he will shower you with good vibes :-)

yeah i did anusara practice regularly for over a year and then some few-month courses spread out over the next year - i love the attention to detail but there's something about the rhetoric that i have to resist/ignore or i end up feeling keyed up and self-conscious. again, depends on the teacher too - even the subtle difference btwn using "we" vs "you" - i like "we"/"let's", which anusara doesn't use. haha i just don't like being told what to do.

i can't deal with most astanga classes - just the wrong kind of tension for me, but sometimes really good for getting mind off other things b/c it can be so intense. i just know a lot of, uh, 'type As' who do it and none of them seem all that yogic (philosophically) to me. but whatever, i guess we all have dif reasons for doing yoga. it kinda freaks me out when people get on the defensive/offensive abt their particular practice - i'm like, wahtever works for you, isn't that point?

i haven't been a yoga man for a v v long time :-/

the weirdest things hurt after doing yoga, such as the tops of my feet. ow tops of my feeeet.

that's how you konw it's working!

roger, I have taken Jake's class. 'e is so copa. I will look for Donovan too.

I kept thinking about "flyers" in class today during all the twists and binds.

o no multiple Jake confusion! (suffice to say Donovan (tuesday nights) has never heard of "rogermexico" - we were neighbors before I moved north)

Roger that. What's your Vector, victor?

ok this is great. i have been doing it for a little over a week and already have definition in my stomach. the tape i am doing is specifically for back care and mostly focuses on lower back, stomach and sides. i should mention that i also have been laying off the beer all week, but yeah it's encouraging to see results so quickly.

:)

Search: tree pose, crow, twists, binds, chattaranga, headstand, shoulder stand, eagle anything

Destroy: Chair pose, side angle pose, tortoise, wheel, handstand

I love yoga but I wish it was cheaper. At a studio a class is around $20 now, which makes it hard to go multiple times a week. I could do it at home but I do better with a teacher leading me. I can finally do a couple of chattarangas before collapsing.

My favorites: cat/cow, downward dog, cobra, sphinx, upward dog, fish. Any back bends/heart openers.

Least faves: triangles, warriors, chair, that thing you go into before crow that is like a squat, pigeon.

Love: shivasana. I've had a few teachers end the class without corpse pose, instead just doing a couple of restful poses such as legs up the wall. Not right.

so not right! <3 shivasana

yoga should srsly not cost so much. i have found several good teachers who understand this here, phew, and even a few who do free community classes for people who would probably otherwise go to a yoga class, whether because of cost or 'culture.'

the only pose i always feel a slight dread/dislike for is bridge/wheel, and i'm not sure why, even though i've gotten better at it. a lot of poses i used to not like, i figured out and like now, which is encouraging to me right now as i'm tackling handstand from the ground up. like totally still faltering at L-pose - where you put yr feet on the wall and hands on the floor and make an L.. it is kinda scary. but that's ok.

i am doing another 1-week everyday 7:30am course starting monday ooh

aww guise I <3 wheel

pincha mayurasana > handstand, but mostly because I suck at handstand

eka pada kundinyasana > crow for same reason, but also because it feels more like flying

CLASSIC

my yoga class is 60mins

the bit at the end (shivasina??!) is SOOOOOO good, guys

any chance of being able to teach myself yoga? eg using a book or the internetz? do you like yoga?

will I be able to do stuff dhalsim does?

RIP Sri. K Patthabi Jois

गते गते पारगते पारसंगते बोधि स्वाहा

o lawd the NYTimes Style section found Vinnie Marino. as always their take on LA is pretty LOL celebs and douchebags but fuck the scene his class is amazing. once you survive your first time, anyway...

http://bit.ly/Y0Xhu

I really enjoy yoga, but all the places around me are either WAY expensive or way inconvenient to my schedule..
Any good yoga podcasts/webvideos that I can follow along to at home?

http://www.yogisanonymous.com/live.php#YogaVideoLibrary

I can personally vouch for Ally, Brock and Kate. They rock.

http://www.yogaglo.com/

I can personally vouch for Marc, Tara, and Noah. Heard very good things about Jason and Kathryn.

Awesome, thanks!

Update: I have it on good authority that Elena Brower (YogaGlo) is also awesome. Might have to sign up and check this stuff out myself!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DiHIs7_iMl8

Am slowly getting into this, but Im pretty guarded and very derisive when the new age hippie bullshit starts creeping in. Ive been to two classes, one at a very nearby studio run by a lady of that kind of hippie/yuppie amalgation endemic to Portland, one who used the word "toxins" unironically. The other was at the big chain gym place I belong to.

The small studio is better for learning the stuff, but the chain gym doesn't have the hippie shit leaking in.

At any rate, am very stressed and anxious right now thanks to work, and the gym doesn't have any classes left today, so I'm heading back to the studio place in a while.

I really like vinyasa style..but all the places close to me either are WAY expensive or totally inconvenient times.

Anyone know any good online videos/podcasts (preferably of the freeee variety!) that are good for using at home?

Why is "toxins" a loaded term?

yoga teacher who used toxins ironically would be p hilar

So I've started doing this after many many people told they thought I'd love it. Guess what? I love it!

We have a lunch time thing at work which is weird mostly because I never thought I'd be walking around my office in yoga pants. The instructor is awesome. Just bought pass to studio by my house. Stoked.

yaay :)

i haven't been doing classes lately, but i do asanas at home and practice yoga breathing, which is A+ for all things incl when you're feeling stressed/anxious

:D

was wondering if anyone knew of a good yoga dvd or set of dvds that would be good for a beginner with pretty poor flexibility?

yogi bear season 2

sorry

maybe i can watch those when i'm crippled and bed-bound :/

H uses the "Bryan Kest Power Yoga" video sometimes. I watch for the lulz.

http://www.demeterclarc.com/wp-content/uploads/images/2012/02/BRYAN-KEST-AND-SEANE-CORN-297x300.png

he says stuff like "but imagine if the masseusse was pushing TOO hard -- you wouldn't call him up to rub you down again"

"power yoga" kinda scares me off, like i said i have poor flexibility, was hoping there was a set that maybe had a really easy ramp-up

weirdly the only thing i've gotten recommended is former pro wrestler Diamond Dallas Page's DVDs, which are supposedly great, but they have a lot of "dude stuff" like where they give moves new "cool" names like i dunno cat pose is like "radical ninja doggie style" or some shit

yeah it's not for true beginners. I tried it once and wound up with a strained neck. it's kind of self-contradictory in that he constantly tells you how you shouldn't be pushing yourself and just "be comforatable where you're at" or whatever, but the screen is full of beautiful people doing flawless yoga

beginning on your own without an instructor is unfortunately very difficult because its hard to know how a pose is supposed to "feel" just by seeing a picture or video of it. particularly when you're not flexible and thus need to be that much more conscious about doing it correctly and not allowing your body to "cheat" and thus cause injury or waste your time. a mirror helps a lot though.

the yoga journal series are not bad--there is a Rodney Yee one on back care yoga (which covers lots of stuff, not just back) that I think would be a good intro.

thx :)

rodney yee is good! be careful and don't push yourself. better to go slower than necessary than too fast.

ok i'll check out some rodney yee stuff, thanks y'all

http://www.yogaglo.com/beginner-center.php

internet-based, no DVD required. within this set of offerings, you'll probably want to start with "Basics" before jumping to "Ashtanga" or "Vinyasa." I can personally vouch for Steven and Tara. i'm sure the other teachers are great too.

that said, i'd echo ryan's note wrt live instruction. as with many physical arts (ballet, jiu-jitsu, guitar) you can teach yourself a lot from videos but there's no substitute for the presence of a teacher, especially in the early stages. no need to worry about your current state of flexibility. that would be sort of like not lifting because you're not already strong. really flexibility is just a by-product of yoga practice. it's something you'll acquire along the way and makes certain things easier but it's not really required at all...

thanks, i know that classes would be the best but i can't see myself dragging myself to class....

will check out that site thanks rogers

Been going to a terrific iyengar yoga class in East London. Which is giving me a terrific foundation - and the teacher is very nice.

I'd say never touch a DVD because you need to work out the line between what is painful and actually a good stretch and how you far you should push yourself in the tougher exercises. Only a good instructor can give you that. I can't get near my toes at the moment and was told not to attempt, as it will come with time, continuous practice and patience.

Other things: - I feel slight aches have 'cleared' completely (and I've only done two classes, so probably nothing major in the first place).

Certain habits are beginning to change:

- Posture in my back is a lot more straight when I walk or sit.

- Both right and left are a lot more balanced, certainly plant both feet a lot more equally in my day-to-day standing and walking.

- I am not sleeping with my pillow anymore. Not sure that's right, but I want to feel both shoulders really touching the mattress.

A final word on breath, its very strange reading lots of lit and poetry (as I do), which can really change your breath, and learning a discipline that also modifies your breath in these exercises.

I'll be going to my first Yoga session soon.

Does anyone have any recommendations for a male?

Choosing what to wear and the mat already seemed quite complex.

Loose fitting soft clothes, preferably with no metal zippers, buttons or clasps.

If you're doing mountains/downward dogs, you might want to avoid wearing an overly baggy top, which would otherwise cover your face and mess with your breathing.

Don't push yourself, take breaks if you're tired, ask the teacher questions.

yeah, I'd go for the opposite of loose-fitting in a shirt. something that lets your shoulders move but hugs the torso is ideal

Thank you for the information, everyone.

I'm looking into getting these prAna pants: http://www.rei.com/product/810244/prana-sutra-pants-mens-32-inseam

As for the top, I have a Nike top that is kind of like this: http://www.rei.com/product/795701/nike-legend-dri-fit-crew-t-shirt-mens

It feels cotton-y, not like a running tshirt, not as breathable. Well-fitted. I'm thinking this should suffice.

Hoping the beginner class doesn't totally destroy my body, because I've never bent my body in those ways.

$70 pants?? Shorts/sweatpants/track pants are my bottoms of choice.

I only have running shorts, and I heard that wearing that isn't very considerate because of how much of my legs would be exposed when doing some positions?

I don't have sweat pants or track pants but I like the idea of track pants. I think I might try that first.

Don't let anyone shame you. Those pants are fine tho not very stretchy.

er, I just do it in shorts - imagine Iyengar (who died two weeks ago) forking out for those..

This is a very good piece on him: http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2014/aug/22/my-teacher-bks-iyengar-yoga

A pupil of Silvia teaches me now.

Oh and R4 (15 mins in): http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b04fcstv

yoga people:

i've been watching myself on video a lot recently for class and holy shit my posture is awful. i have the thing where my shoulders point inwards and are tense (pulled up) plus my head is tilted forward -- terrible. it causes tension too so i am trying to eliminate this habit.

what are the best yoga programs/postures for correcting bad posture? also, is core strength really the key here or is it other stuff? i can't afford a chiropractor so i am crowdsourcing folk wisdom on this

What do you mean watching yourself on video? Do you have a teacher who corrects your posture? If not, find a new teacher.

I think he's a schoolteacher and he saw himself on video.

I'm the king of bad posture despite taking yoga -- for me, it's only taught me what good posture is, and doesn't necessarily enforce it in everyday life.

However, something that's helped me lately is to think of the base of your skull as having a knob, and then pulling that knob straight back (without raising your chin) -- that'll help you avoid the hunched-over computer slouch.

Another suggestion is to imagine that you have a string attached to the top of your head: imagine yourself suspended in the air from this string to get tall/elongate your spine and to avoid arching your back.

lee's got it. the class is a grad school class, not a yoga class, so in the videos i am lecturing and stuff. sorry it was unclear.

yes, i assume that deliberate corrections during the day are going to be a big part of this. i think it has to be part of larger, body language awareness. i am kind of "pulled in" and that signals nervousness, i think, even though i don't feel that way.

i am too busy to go to any of the yoga classes at my university gym so i am going to look to the internet now. i am doing other fitness stuff, but i think yoga is probably essential for developing body awareness and also flexibility to prevent injury

Oh ok. I didn't understand what you meant. I really like yoga for body awareness. Best of luck to you.

good posture is a constant battle since practically everything else in our lives works against it.

it's true. technology deforms us all, mentally and physically

even beginning to contemplate the kind of holistic transformation that would have to take place for my posture to improve always makes me think of the incessant jesus prayer, like in franny and zooey, that i would have to so absorb a conscious awareness of the ideal as to be practicing improvement at all times, simultaneous with all other thought. instead i know when i walk down the street i just periodically make ridiculous-looking momentary corrective adjustments, strides that lunge into a kind of pinned-back breathed-in verticalism & which then slouch back into seahorse pose within ten paces

anyway i was maybe going to start yoga too. lil worried i'm coming to it with too fervent a Businessman Chugging Wheatgrass expectation that it will immediately fix me. there is this six-inch-square grid of chiropractic real estate that i feel like hasn't moved or rotated in like fifteen years

honestly, if people followed through with their plans to only eat whole, organic foods (mostly organic vegetables) and to follow a consistent, well-planned exercise regimen, i think they would "fix" a lot.

i only eat vegetables & i keep a consistent exercise routine of not doing a lot of exercise but guess walking everywhere & this city is pretty damn big & i still think of the bit in that film where the guy kills himself with an electric drill quite often

yeah but if you ate doughnuts and drove everywhere imagine how much worse off you'd be

but i am not allowed doughnuts & after work i'm tired & i always thought i'd do pretty well inside a car (tapes, don't mind waiting around in traffic &c)

honestly, if people followed through with their plans to only eat whole, organic foods (mostly organic vegetables) and to follow a consistent, well-planned exercise regimen, i think they would "fix" a lot

I sort of want to believe this, but I basically don't.

I am very pro-yoga, though, all the same.

well, the good news is yoga won't fix anything overnight. if you stick with it though, it will def help with posture, especially for the deskbound.

best "program" imo would be a vinyasa class that you enjoy. this is the slow, steady kind of change that lasts so just sticking with it is the big thing. a lot of what you're learning is body awareness/muscle memory type stuff so there's no substitute for getting reps in.

thanks for the tips!

you guys don't think that diet and exercise and reducing stress can radically improve most people's lives? (emphasis on most -- obviously some problems are intractable.) i feel that so much in our life works against health, actively addressing these things is very important. don't always practice this.

i think no one can agree on what a healthy diet and well-planned exercise regime actually are.

people disagree on the specifics but a few things are uncontroversial. for instance, refined sugar and trans fats are bad. never eating plants in their whole state is bad. barely moving all day is also bad.

ok but you know how incredibly simplistic and impractical that is when trying to translate to things people do

why impractical?

i'm not saying it is easy to adjust one's habits to be healthier, i am just saying that the benefits are potentially enormous. and not just in the long term. i can tell that i feel better on days when i avoid high-glycemic garbage in favor of real food. also, i made enormous strides in health when i started sleeping 7-8 hours a night instead of 5. i think this stuff matters.

http://cdn.images.express.co.uk/img/dynamic/11/590x/Elderly-couple-using-a-laptop-504720.jpg

how did you find that photo of me and call all destroyer?

I think I saw same recent studies that cast doubt on the 'trans fat is always bad' theory, though I may be well off base.

trans fat is always artificially synthesized (i think) so i think it's safe to say your body doesn't need it, even if it might not be as bad as some projections would have it.

as always though, it's also possible i don't really know what i am talking about and my comments come from a desire to, in a faithless society, place my faith in the human body and its capacity for healing

you guys don't think that diet and exercise and reducing stress can radically improve most people's lives?

I dunno, I just went from a near-zero exercise regime to twice a week intense workouts and while I really like it I wouldn't say it's radically changing my life at all. It's radically changing my ability to lift heavy things, but it doesn't change my life outside the gym very much. A few years ago I spent six weeks cutting essentially all sugar and grain out of my diet and that also didn't create any radical change: I felt the same, looked the same, weighed the same, etc.

Note: I feel like changes of diet and exercise can make you live longer and be healthier when you're old, so that kind of IS a radical change of your life-as-a-whole, but I had the sense you were talking about your life-in-the-now.

i also should say that i find it almost impossible to believe that your body is affected by organic food any differently than it is by non-organic food.

i do not relate to that at all. when i am not eating well or exercising i emotionally feel like shit.

what are the best yoga programs/postures for correcting bad posture? also, is core strength really the key here or is it other stuff? i can't afford a chiropractor so i am crowdsourcing folk wisdom on this

― Treeship, Wednesday, 10 December 2014 Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

An advice would be doing the standing poses against the wall, That should get you into -- as you stretch in the class triangle pose, for example -- keep in absolute line.

Sorry its a bit garbled but hopefully you know what I mean.

I think technology is a big culprit, but it even goes farther than that imo. maybe this is kooky, but it just doesn't seem like our spines are well designed for being upright all the time. so "good posture" is less finding a holistic "natural" spine position so much as it is fighting against its poor design to distribute weight different, keep it moving, etc. so it's always a conscious, directed thing. so yeah yoga is a great way to become "mindful" about how your body is positioned throughout the day.

Hey yogis, to properly open up my hamstrings, I need to feel the pull in my sit bones, not just behind my thighs, right? Any suggested poses, or is it the usual array but with knees bent to accommodate the stretch?

Depends on the asana - in Trikonasana you shouldn't let the bum stick out at all - by doing so you should feel an 'opening' in the hamstring.

You don't need to bend a knee, in the basic Tasasana you are opening the hamstring, maintaning tension by a lift of the kneecaps.

i've been really into inverted poses in the last few months
it really helps to change perspective, if you're in the need of that sort of thing

Attending a 'Level 2' class since NY. Inverted triangle is fine on one side, on the other (left) I nearly fell over.

Teacher said I wasn't ready to go upside down yet so I did a part dog pose with my head touching the floor to prepare. Hard times at the moment but still learning a lot.

Inverted triangle is fine on one side, on the other (left) I nearly fell over.

It happens!

Teacher said I wasn't ready to go upside down yet so I did a part dog pose with my head touching the floor to prepare. Hard times at the moment but still learning a lot.

Sounds like what I know as the dolphin pose. There is a secret trick that makes head stands really easy to get into but I hesitate to offer it.

do them against a wall first? why hesitate to say that? it's safety-minded.
it made them easier for me. i use a support beam in my basement but same concept.

Not wall-related (I personally don't like doing headstands against them). My hesitation is if people aren't necessarily ready for it, because THIS ONE TRICK will get them upside down easily.

ok well i don't know this trick then!
i don't care about doing headstands against the beam because the benefit is the same and i feel safer. i usually do yoga alone and will do p much anything to avoid injury.

(btw I almost always fall over in half-moon pose, so yeah its cool.)

Thanks Leee, its the Dolphin - although my head was closer to my hands.

Yes I tried doing it against the wall first. I did do it at first but actually didn't trust that I was doing it right so came down, asked for help (class of ~ 10 so teacher was helping someone else), called her over and she told me to not get into it right now..

is it bad to do yoga on carpet (w/or w/o a mat) when i goog search all i get are ads for expensive platforms

It's harder to balance certain poses like tree, but I just went to a studio that was carpeted, but I don't think it's actively bad. The cushion will make certain other poses more comfortable, in fact.

Maybe contact a yoga studio if they are getting rid of some and you could get a cheap 2nd hand mat?

I would use a mat as I am getting precise about using that space to measure my stride for triangle and right angle poses. Also my feet are placed at the back edge of the mat for those, it all helps alignment.

Also prefer to place blankets on a mat.

Otherwise I wouldn't think it as actively bad.

the mat isn't the problem, i just dk if it, like, compromises your yoga if you have a carpet underneath. my carpet isn't too thick anyway so i'll just deal with it. thx

I don't think carpet should be the factor that keeps you from doing yoga!

Amazon search shows a zillion options for between 15 & 20. Don't do it on carpet my for slipped and I got hurt one time

what are you searching for that i'm not? all i see is "lifeboard" which is way too much

just like a yoga mat right? like the foam ones that roll up? i just searched for yoga mat on amazon, unless you mean something different?

you can buy a yoga mat anywhere, like i think you can even get them at walgreens
they're probably even under $20

the $20 mats kinda suck tho

Well fine but they're easy to find and acceptable for a beginner. It's probably disgusting but I've been using the same mat (on and off) since 2000.

yeah i dunno i've never had a good one, seems fine, keeps you from slipping i guess

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/aufrog/Smilies/Favorite%20Smilies/siren.gif there has been a misunderstanding http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt258/aufrog/Smilies/Favorite%20Smilies/siren.gif

i am talking about portable floor/something flat to put under the yoga mat so it is not just a yoga mat on carpet, i am buying a yoga mat

Then I'd say don't worry about it?!

Plywood?

i'm just going to not use anything if that option has officially been deemed non-life threatening

yah um i do yogers with mat on carpet all the time and im not dead, maybe a little TWISTED though!

Yoga mattresslessness.

j/k i like hard surfaces more but what are you gonna do? no patio, the park a block away is not convenient enough so my bedroom it is

going on a yoga holiday in July (organised by my teacher) (obv I don't see it as hol as I don't really go on holiday - its necessary work)

she is then going on a sabbatical for six months so I will have to find someone new.

I went to a kundalini chanting event/gong bath and it was very enjoyable. Wasn't quite sure what to expect outside of the promised wall of gongs but I'm glad I went.

Just came back yesterday from mine (and then went back out for London catch-up over drinks so a bloody long day). It was an Iyengar yoga retreat so worked on lots of poses (and a Pranayama intro) for up to five hours each day. Got to talk and exchange ideas with a few yogis. Besides it being a holiday, of course!

Great and worked out what I can and can't do so a home practice that I am confident with is in sight.

Got to know my teacher (we both love similar sorts of films!), shame she is moving away from London for a while (and possibly for good). She can handle a class with all abilities and I'll miss her, though I will see her in a workshop in a couple of months.

So now the task is on finding another teacher. But at least I know what a good teacher does - Iyengar has several levels of qualification and teachers have had to do it for a few years - but you tend to get tricky customers. A lot of fun to come!

Got hurt at a studio while doing a shoulder stand -- thinking because I'd gotten used to placing a blanket under my shoulders, and doing it without was enough to throw off my alignment -- and in a fit of pique went on a hiatus for about a month.

Went back to the same studio, but a different teacher, and I'm enjoying it again. Looking forward to trying her Ashtanga primary series when I have the time.

And probably off-topic (because it's more ballet-related) but I now have something resembling a forward split!

ashtanga primary series damn dude

u intense

the year I practiced that series every day was amazing, I was in my early twenties and def th best shape of my life

I'm not that good at it tbh! I'm a weekend yogi at best, I have to cheat if I want to get into bakasana, my shoulders are too stiff for a forearm stand, my balance is terrible, etc., etc.

And my Ashtanga experience has been almost exclusively with an intro-level class, so who knows!

full primary is the bomb but def takes time and consistency

Did my first bakasana into chataranga today! Most challenging thing though was staying in crow because I kept slipping off my arms because of the sweat.

congrats!

I still haven't mastered the slippy arms problem. theoretically real ultimate core strength will overcome that but i am not there yet. more lolasana for me.

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/nov/23/yoga-classes-cultural-appropriation

As someone who has practised yoga for a good couple of years I am looking at this story of the cancelled yoga class and the link above from a slightly different angle. Have black or fat women been stopped from going to yoga classes, or are they strongly made to feel unwelcome?

Who is it that builds this perception that yoga is for fit blonde women? Obviosuly the way its reported by the media and sold has its problems - but from what I've heard of the class at that uni its open for everyone and free so that isn't part of the problem and not where I would go to use words like 'decolinised'. The Guardian is also part of it and people who have a couple of brain cells should try and separate it from the way its reported to the way it is - classes are made up of older people and many who have some form of disability. Anecdotal evidence of overheard conversation at a fkn festival and having a quick scan around the room isn't journalism.

Doing Iyengar still but taken up a yoga where we do Ujjayi breaths. its very relaxed, the teacher isn't that bothered about straightening legs all the time (she tells me to 'unlock' them). Still learning but its interesting.

thinking of trying a few classes

is there such a thing anymore as normcore yoga? like i dont want a hot room or rope or any high energy nonsense, just quiet calm etc

i'm not sure what to look for, there's so many types!

nb am not super flexible/athletic

Veg, Hatha's quietude sounds like it'd be your thing. Mostly holding relaxed poses for 1+ minutes.

And you don't have to be flexible when you start yoga! You develop your flexibility THROUGH yoga.

thanks! looks like there's a studio not far from my house that offers asha :D

Second hatha yoga -- that's how I started

Ropes etc can help get you into poses although there can be too much faffing around if the Iyengar class isn't well directed.

My current teacher doesn't use as many.

excited to start trying this imo

isn't hatha yoga just, like, physical yoga eg any type of yoga in which you practice asanas?

eg iyengar, ashtanga, bikram, vinyasan flow whatever all these popular schools/systems/types of yoga are just various interpretations/instances of hatha yoga? idk i could be way off

ime iyengar is the most accessible to beginners and is the most "no frills" type - no music, no hot rooms, no new agey western yoga mysticism. there are definitely ropes, blocks, straps etc but those are all just tools to make the poses more accessible to practitioners

Maybe I'm conflating Hatha with Yin/restorative yoga; I sort of associate Iyengar with holding Warrior for minutes, whereas what I'm calling Hatha is like holding a forward bend for minutes.

Veg, by asha do you mean ashtanga (which is a more vigorous style with arm/head balances and fancy jumping).

Hatha is general yoga. The two main styles that grew off Hatha are Iyengar and Ashtanga - and both of those were taught by Krishnamacharya: http://www.asia.si.edu/explore/yoga/youtube.asp?id=krishnamacharya

Svastha is another style but way less known.

Bikram is quite limiting - you are meant to do it in a hot room and its the same sequence of asanas over and over which doesn't sound v appealing. From doing a couple of styles I'd say they all do similar things - its the emphasis on various aspects that's different. Then again different teachers in one style will teach an asana in a slightly different way as well.

well this place offers hatha among other things & it sounds exactly as chill & normcore as I'm looking for

Hope you enjoy it! Stretching and getting stronger are top notch physical sensations imo. I've been working on my headstand for like a year and I can finally do it without wall support. Nothing helps me shift perspective like a solid headstand!

I see what you did there, Lech!

Hathayoga as a general term describes any physically-oriented form of yoga (as opposed to e.g. seated meditation). That said, in the US a class described as "Hatha Yoga" would typically be expected to be less physically vigorous than e.g. Vinyasa or Power yoga and require less experience linking breath and movement. Good place to start imo :)

thx rog!

I was pondering on the drive home how successful yoga practices would be if there wasn't a semi-bastardized conceptual framework overlaid

"Hey, want to go to a meet-up in the park and do some stretching and strength exercises?"

yoga is good though, imo

i have all kinds of digestive weirdness and weird aches & i thought some stretching might help over time

plus i really need the breathing/meditation for relaxation

i'm a mess rn lol

i don't have a regular practice right now because my life is crazy but i did have one for a number of years, basically on/off since 2001, yoga is amazing. even now when i do like 20 minutes at the end of the day, i'm astonished by how much physical/mental/emotional tension is released after just a few asanas

Some poetry from Patanjali: http://www.asymptotejournal.com/special-feature/patanjali-vibhuti-pada-the-chapter-of-dubious-glories/

^^^ v yogic

TS: Kino MacGregor vs. Briohny Smyth

short answer: your mom

i just finished my 3 week intro to yoga workshop with a hatha instructor & i loooooved it. me & four other ppl, mainly seniors. super chill & GREAT

instructor is nice & normcore and not scary like the last instructor i tried. she has a deep well of yoga knowledge, v friendly & funny

doing thurs night classes starting this week, space is a buddhist temple (!) - v excited

beforei found the workshop i tried a hatha class & the instructor was like an snl parody, weirdly passive agressive & would stare into your eyes & say I LOVE WHAT I DO in a way that seemed like she did not at all

the class was cool but she just made me feel v stressed, glad that i went back to the drawing board & found someone more my speed

yr situation sounds v rad. especially temple access. i am trying to do a lil youtube yoga at home, i got derailed when it turned into Xtreme Cardio Crunch Workout. i was really looking to roll around more instead of do slo-mo cross-fit

i learned ujaiyi breath :D

Yes that's what I'm doing in Svastha yoga, which I try to use in my Iyengar class sometimes. Just that deeper engagement with breath and movement earlier on - in Iyengar the breath usually comes later.

Real question is how do you do with mula bandha?

i had to google it - they havent covered that

basically a kegel. at which I rule.

Tighten the muscle you'd tighten to stop peeing mid-stream. At least that's what I found when I googled it after my female yoga teacher was unable to give me a good answer.

(uh, i realize now that this is a super-late answer, but I'll leave it in case anyone else wonders. Or if someone knows this my answer to be wrong and can correct me)

I started up yoga again a few months ago after a 10+ year break. I had been getting pretty badly out of shape, plus suffering from neck/shoulder pain from compressed discs. My main weekly class is called Fundamentals of Ashtanga, which goes through the primary sequence of Ashtanga, but is a bit more lenient in terms of variations. I really like my teacher, she is the right mix of nice and supportive, but also serious about what she does. The class itself is very grueling, just about at the max physical limit for what I can endure, and that's even with all the things that I either can't do, do easier variations on, or just plain skip. Still I manage to keep up and am growing a bit more limber.

Outside of this class, I do whatever fits my schedule, usually somewhat less impactful classes. I don't love the whole heated room thing. It's been especially bad the last few weeks because the AC unit at the yoga studio has been busted, which isn't a good thing in Texas during the summer. Everyone else seems ok with it, so I'm just rolling with it.

what are my options for keeping my hair out of my face that isn't a man bun?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Let%27s_trim_our_hair_in_accordance_with_the_socialist_lifestyle

buzz it! It's liberating

bbut i love my hair!

It grows back. And people who have hair to care about look the best when they buzz it. Plus summer is the optimum time to buzz it.

depends how long yer hair is but i use this headband

http://www.kooshoo.com/collections/aurea-headbands-mensonly

you have to wrap it around twice

my only complaint is it sometimes gives me bad bedhair when the back of my head is on the floor and the band moves

I used to see longhair guys with ponytails in my yoga class pretty frequently. I shave my head, though.

I'm trying to work my way up to the full shave. Not sure I'm ready yet.

Buzzing is a weird thrill everybody should try at least once. You'll absolutely hate that you did it the first day, start to warm to it by day two or three, and then a few weeks later you'll start to get bummed that it's growing back

also the feeling of stepping out of the shower and having a dry head within seconds is ++++++++++++

u can have short hair without buzzing it, wtf guys

go entirely bald shave your entire body this is the only way

Any suggestions for a good ashtanga video on YT that gives room for variations (read: physical shortcomings)? I might have to start practicing on my own in the near future and don't have the entire primary series committed to memory yet.

my instructor helped me with a down dog variation on the wall that I really like & then the next class we did normal down dog like 5 times ;_;

time to bring your own wall

also i think i have finally gotten the hang of ujjayi breath & feel v accomplished

I'm really not getting the hang of ujjayi breath. I've even taken a super beginners course and it still seems odd to me.

I've been doing a Fundamentals of Ashtanga class for the last several months. The class covers only the first half of the series and encourages modifications whenever needed. It still kicks my ass, but the repetition has allowed me to find lots of ways to modify various parts either because I can't do them the right way or because I need to avoid things that mess up my neck. I'd love to talk modifications if anyone would find that helpful.

This video is pretty representative of what my class covers, although I flop around and sweat and sniffle a lot more than the lady in the video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Krp4W0TlAU

Yeah, after trying to go along with what I take to be a fairly authoritative video, I figured that if Sri Pattabhi Jois's breaths were too short for me, I'd be better off on my own.

My solo practice is a little intermittent, but I'm starting to develop my series with variations (I don't like doing the weird split leg, roll-around ones -- I do like adding a pigeon pose).

What kind of variations do you like, Moodles?

that video was O_O
pretty sure i will never be that limber
my hatha class is ridic chill & def more my speed. but when i see other yoga practice i feel like a toddler lol

Yoga is not a competitive sport - that's why I like it!

Yeah, these videos definitely show an idealized version that I know I will never get close to, but they are at least helpful in laying out what to aim for.

One thing that I do in a bunch of positions that involve a bind is using a strap to make up the difference.
For shoulder stands, I've been using a block to prop up my back, which helps take pressure off my neck. Also sometimes just do legs up the wall.
I can't do headstands at all, so I do a version of plank with forearms on the ground.
For hopping forward and backward, out of down dog or into plank, I've been trying to get less forceful and lighten a bit, instead of landing like a bag of bricks, which was jarring on my neck.

I can't do most of the what that video shows, either! I don't have the flow committed to memory yet (and I've been doing this for years) so needed it for reference.

I can't do headstands at all, so I do a version of plank with forearms on the ground.

Do you mean dolphin pose?

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/68/75/fe/6875fef132455b568dc227f0206fb28a.jpg

BTW, for jump-throughs, have you tried putting blocks under your hands? That way you have more room for your legs, which I bet would help with your control. And from recent personal experience, I realized how much work my lower core needs to be able to retract my legs enough to do a smooth jump-through.

more like a plank version of that without my butt up in the air, but dolphin pose would work too

I haven't tried blocks, but I could see how that would make it easier. I think I have short arms or something.

everyone thinks they have short arms... or long legs... and we all have our quirks but it's amazing how consistent practice (and, as leee says, a lot of core work) can lengthen up those arms or shorten those legs or whatever.

Maty Ezraty says it took her eight years to get solid on the jumpthrough. Until then, blocks definitely help.

turtles actually have short legs iirc

lol true

One yoga teacher (she is just starting) said I had really long arms. Took a few classes, she was ok but as I've moved now I don't go there anymore.

Last 3 months I've been going to classes by a couple of excellent teachers at this place 5 mins from where I live, one of whom is a Senior Iyengar yoga teacher. The Capital S is earned, she is very good and strict at what she does (with a funny edge which means when she tells you off its ok), and I'm always learning. She started in her 40s "at a low ebb" and it offers hope to all of us tbh. The intermediate class is a bit of a jump for me but I feel like I am improving, and with my bits of home practice it means no bastard can grind me down no more.

The other teacher is very good too. Above all, well, she is just my type. Its just wrong really.

Iyengar is not my personal jam but any Senior Iyengar teacher is legit af.
Very serious training and not a designation you can earn just by showing up for x number of hours.

Indeed. None of this 200 hrs crap*. Iyengar teachers need to have practiced yoga for a few years then have a recommendation from an already qualified teacher to be accepted into training (or so I believe). Then its tough exams. And if you pass (and many fail) there are a few levels to get to Senior. Its quite an accmplishment for this woman. This partic teacher just pushes me to practice more (I always want to be doing yoga but fkn life man). I broke my big toe two months ago and recovered enough to go to a class after 3 weeks but not hers, just need to go back to a basic level just to keep it up.

Anyway, at my level you can definitely see the difference between a teacher that has only done it for a bit vs a Senior.

* ok not saying they are all like that - and 200 hrs is a lot of yoga.

iyengar teachers are the real deal

I am forever grateful that my first yoga study was with very legit Iyengar including John Schumacher. Having Iyengar as a foundation makes dipping into other styles safer and more meaningful imo.

^^ very much agreed. there are a lot of folks who have only practiced "vinyasa flow" who kinda have no idea

and i love vinyasa flow!

so so true. I've done a few classes of flow yoga about 6 months ago and imo what Iyengar teaches you is precision in the asanas. Really important not to fall into bad habits that are injury forming.

The one other teacher at my current studio is a former Iyengar teacher (who is also in the buddhist order) who does two types of classes: one of which is more flow based and another which is yoga+meditation (went to a couple of them as I was on my way back from broken toe) and while that didn't work for me I felt that were I ever to move from Iyengar to other practices I'd have a good foundation. But I am only interested in shadow yoga and the guy who came up with it was one of Iyengar's former pupils. No classes nearby tho'.

No longer interested in shadow yoga. Only Iyengar and Yin yoga (a very gentle practice, no inversions which is a shame, but you hold poses for minutes at a time - so deceptively light, however I've only been for a class or two)

This is a great piece on Iyengar teaching - and the critical teaching I get from the teacher I've been with for a year now (the one I mention above)

https://yogaspy.com/2017/09/25/a-critical-teacher/

Also started a practice course with the same teacher (one session a month for 5 months). So she has given a 15 min practice to do everyday (I was practicing for about 30 mins to an hour 2/3 times a week but scaled all that back for now) and we're looking at practicing paranayama safely in the next session.

nothing gentle about yin lol. those long holds can be fkn brutal.

Yes indeed, didn't mean to downplay it...

I've had to ramp down my practice recently due to repeated injuries. Need to find a way to keep up without killing myself, but it's been tough finding the right balance.

Negotiating so I can practice intensely but with the heightened awareness to avoid injury.

Good to ramp it down, look at the asanas that are causing injury and maybe adapt so you can keep practising and looking at it.

Been practicing most days for about an hour this month, and started doing some pranayama too.

In my experience if there is an injury then - funnily enough - doing yoga is what aids the recovery. I did my back a little bit when I tried this tough twist but then I did a lighter practice the next day and that cleared it off.

yeah, i'm finding that as long as i finish an hour of running with an hour of yoga my legs are fine and if i skip even just twice, i end up with an injury.

i skipped it today but i have been going to a workplace free yoga class taught by my coworker and it is so wonderful. not only does it feel good, but stretch-bonding with my coworkers is a nice side effect.
otherwise i normally do yoga in my basement by myself. going to the class 1x a week is really nice because i don't have to make any decisions and someone else (the teacher) is in the driver's seat. not being in the driver's seat periodically is essential for people who work in emotionally draining professions imo.

Plus a teacher shows you other ways to do things and streches (no pun intended) any notions of what might be possible.

ok shit I have a groin strain on my right leg aargh - got it by doing warrior pose against the wall.

I am still practicing every day - but not that.

Has anyone here had this? How long does it take to heal up?

I had a minor car crash about 1 1/2 weeks ago and I crunched my wrist, not sure that it is a full on fracture, mire like a bine bruise, but it looks like I'm done with yoga until next year. 😣

damn sorry to hear that - my body really missed yoga for about 2/3 weeks when I broke my toe last year.

(someone I know is a piano player and has had issues practicing yoga with her wrist issues but now has qualified recently to teach yoga..)

I've had a series of injuries over the past year, mostly shoulders and neck, that have slowed me down, but this is the first one where I feel like I just need need to stop for a while.

that's crazy, i ALSO got a groin strain on my right leg this past thursday when i was climbing. It really pulls you out of running/yoga/climbing for sure.

Depending on the severity, my understanding is between a week and a half to several months will heal it. I was bouldering ten feet up on a wall when i heard a pop in my upper thigh... not a good feeling.

I believe you want to avoid static stretching while the adductors heal... they're tiny little muscles but they can bounce back if you don't fuck with them too hard. The pain from it is waking me up in the mornings but it's starting to fade a bit... unfortunately it also feels like it's pulling against my right testicle all the time, which is a very funky and unpleasant sensation.

sorry about your wrist moodles, that sucks. maybe talk to your yoga teacher and ask if they have recommendations for work you can do at home to make sure the scar tissue doesn't cause problems later?

Actually a day or two after I posted that back in November the strain cleared enough so I could walk at my usual pace and then I kept practicing. It is now pretty much gone. I didn't feel any strain whatsoever in class this morning.

Course finished last month - we went through a variety of approaches so I am using that plus getting whatever bits and pieces I learn in class. I make notes (though not as much as I should) from class and try and incorporate with the practice the week after too.

In May it will be nearly four years since I've started - and given what has been going on personally I have to say it just makes things a bit better. Any bit of daily practice gives me 'space' and strengthens my nervous system for the challenges ahead. I will need it.

I'm back at Hatha Flow now even though my hand hasn't healed up at all after 3 months. Using a block to prop up my right arm for stuff like down dog and plank. I'm really feeling the lack of exercise for 2 months, everything seems way harder than I remember.

Alabama may lift a decades-old ban on yoga in public schools, but the greeting "namaste" would remain on the forbidden list. Under a bill in the state House local school systems could teach yoga, but moves and exercises would have to have English names. https://t.co/sttgfCylZv

— The Associated Press (@AP) March 8, 2020

do they allow French in ballet classes?

Funnily enough I tried this power yoga class run by an Indian teacher yesterday.

Looked him up and he has a decolonising yoga project and he seems really left-wing (judging by his twitter). He is very much into demystifying yoga for complete beginners.

I'll go now and then as we don't often get to practice arm balances in Iyengar yoga.

Anyone got recommendations for YouTube yogis? I can’t see myself going back to class for a while

A couple of teachers I know are doing zoom classes. Not ideal but this is all that is available to me.

I have used this time to actually practice using the sequences at the back of Light on Yoga. First time I have really engaged with it, the photographs of Iyengar doing advanced postures always put me off.

I started doing yoga for the first time ever to counteract the effects of working from a kitchen chair all day, just using that Down Dog channel. It's ok, I like it fine, nothing overly challenging and it's easy to follow. I have nothing to compare it to though.

Anyone got recommendations for YouTube yogis? I can’t see myself going back to class for a while

― badg, Thursday, 2 April 2020 bookmarkflaglink

A lot of studios are doing online classes. Do you mean specific YouTube only ppl?

I believe the place I had been going to, Black Swan Yoga, has a daily livestream on YouTube. Can't vouch for their quality. They also have an app you can subscribe to that has a bunch of content.

"Black Swan Yoga" is a bit on the nose, no?

I like EkhartYoga and Fightmaster Yoga on YouTube. I avoid classes with music (just no) and instructors I find irritating (obv).

There's a lot that's unfortunate about their branding, tbh. I'm hesitant to fully endorse them because their vibe is a little offputting in general, but I at least get solid workouts from their routines.

xp

I avoid classes with music (just no) and instructors I find irritating (obv).

yeah i'm permanently scarred from having a beck song come up on some instructor's playlist.

The studio where my wife teaches is streaming live throughout the day On IG and archiving on FB. I highly recommend a Bikram class with Gary or Power with Claudia.

https://m.facebook.com/ashrambellevue/

I use this for Ashtanga:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJzfZ6w0s4g

Though there's also this class from K Pattabhi Jois too, which I haven't checked out.

I like this one

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Krp4W0TlAU

yeah i'm permanently scarred from having a beck song come up on some instructor's playlist.

Lol! This happened to me too w Beck but it was a free class my coworker was giving and I let it slide, she’s nice and I like her. The only music-containing yoga class I’ve enjoyed that wasn’t self-directed within the last 15 years was a metal yoga class. I love the immersive loudness and now I just do metal yoga at home.

Strongly recommend the track “Catharsis” by YOB bc it’s 23 min long (perfect for warmup) and has a spectacular ending.

Most of the non Ashtanga classes I've attended have had some kind of music, ranging from unobtrusive to painfully cringe inducing. The best ones lean heavily towards balearic bliss. I will credit one teacher, who mostly had terrible taste, for once having a playlist that featured "Tears in the Typing Pool" into "Parallelograms".

I sort of expect & enjoy fairly cheesy songs at class but an instructor played Bill Callahan once which was a pleasant surprise.

Thanks for the recommendations they were exactly what I was looking for.

We just tried a Yoga app that used Nick Cave’s soundtrack from The Road, which was a little on the nose.

I like Yoga with Adrienne. She can be cloying but I like the pacing and she’s good (speaking as an amateur) at explaining the moves. And she has a cute dog.

Though there's also this class from K Pattabhi Jois too, which I haven't checked out.

― Triceratops Vowell (Leee), Thursday, 2 April 2020 bookmarkflaglink

It's a notorious demonstration in that community but it isn't for beginners.

Adrienne uses the word “yummy” too much for me bit otherwise I think she is a good teacher.

I've been using Yogiapproved.com for classes since before this started.

no annoying music so far, but they have a 30 day free trial and a lot of classes so its fairly mindless to open up the app and decide on something.

I mainly use the same 3/4 classes. but I have no issues with the range.

they also do something called 'outlaw yoga' which I have a strange fascination with, it seems to be yoga for aging bikers, but with a dude playing guitar in the background to take the edge off...

I've watched the trailer loads in weird fascination but can't bring myself to actually open one of the courses.

Adrienne uses the word “yummy” too much for me bit otherwise I think she is a good teacher.

Disgusting
No one should be describing anything as juicy or yummy during a YOGA class? No.

Juicy gets used a lot, it's a problem

you mean like "a deep juicy stretch"? yuck.

Ms. T. and I used to go to a studio that catered to "angry screenwriters and suspicious IT workers" years back and ran across the Yoga With Adriene videos at the beginning of the pandemic. Her teaching style works well with us, especially since it's just the two of us at home watching a YouTube video, and I'm somewhere between ambivalent and not-giving-a-shit about her adjective choices.

I knew my posture was bad, but I didn't know just how bad it was. Twenty months of daily practice (yes, daily) later, I'm totally shocked to discover that I gained almost a centimeter of height back.

Amen to Yoga With Adriene, I'd let my regular yoga lapse since my old Y membership expired but a friend recommended her videos last year and I'm back to at least several times a week. I really like her range of classes, that you can pick one for just neck and shoulders if those are sore or whatever. And her patter's generally pretty likable. Anyway, yes to regular yoga!

Just thought I'd draw your attention to the journal of yoga studies. All open access.

There has been plenty of scholarship on the roots of modern yoga but this is something else. Papers on yoga and its relationship to dance, Indian martial arts. Yoga in China and Tibet. I am making my way through it so will read some articles and say anything as and when.

https://journalofyogastudies.org/index.php/JoYS/issue/view/2023.V4

Sickening.

https://www.middleeasteye.net/opinion/india-modi-yoga-whitewash-crimes-use-how

Though I will never practice Ashtannga at a Shala with a shrine to Patthabi I found this interview (from 2009, before the abuse surfaced) fascinating.

https://www.integralashtanga.com/mind-medicine/2024/9/7/interview-with-brad-ramsey

I had been meaning to try Bikram for a while now after years of various flow and corepower on stop-and-start basis. Went to my first proper Bikram class a couple of days ago and loved it. Just the right pace and the instructor was super cool to this newbie and my daughter. The intensity of the heat felt great rather than punitive as it does at Corepower, even though the Bikram room is 10 degrees hotter. Will go back.

Been reading Elliott Goldberg's "The Path of Modern Yoga" which comes after Mark Singleton's "Yoga Body" (which it argues with at times). Really informative in the first place: looking at the way Indian teachers like Yogendra expanded yoga by putting on classes (before this it was always one-on-one from teacher to student, which is ofc not commercially viable), then Swami Kuvalayananda propagation of Yoga as health/quackery, building up to Krishnamacharya and Iyengar..though I've yet to get to that bit.

While I partly agree with the thesis of these books there is an undercurrent of Western journo/academics hounding Easterners for not citing everything they say; its a journalist-thing in trying to get at the truth except its not a corrupt politician but just some random Indian bloke trying to get by with what sounds like good intentions of helping other ppl. Its too text based, when old books on yoga (which they cite and I'm reading rn) weren't books or even manuals but read like teacher to student class notes. Transmission was oral, and a lot of it is to be practiced with a lot of trial and error on the student's part. So any changes and innovations were organic.

The other undercurrent is of this sort of liberal politics of feeling aggrieved or cheated somehow. Like yoga was sold as this thousand year old indigenous practice, and now it turns out that what's being taught today is a modern take. There is almost a relief that their yoga mats can be stored away and you can go to a gym or do pilates now, they have the license.

I do think this feeling 'aggrieved or cheated' is an odd take on yoga. A bigger problem feels like the rampant commercialisation and 'life-styling' of modern yoga practice (for example the Lululemon 'yummy mummy' yoga accessories) rather than Yoga's historic authenticity.

How authentic are the Boxing/Boxercise/Fixboxing/non-contact boxing classes that are offered in many gyms?

Well I am talking about the mindset of those writers and how some of those books were positively received at the time in reviews. It feels like they are having a go at some more recent takes on genuinely interesting variations of Hatha Yoga just because it isn't noted down.

I have no idea about boxing but I guess some of the yoga equivalents could be things like acro yoga and so on. But yes the expansion and commercialiasiation (like the way its been absorbed into a fitness) can bring its own set of problems for sure.

In traditional martial arts, it's common for instructors and students to be strongly invested in questions of lineage and history and to claim that their forms of practice are more authentic than others. The same phenomenon is not unusual in yoga schools.

Recent historical research has documented how much these disciplines as they exist now were shaped by Western ideas of pedagogy in the 19th and 20th centuries. There's been a lot of resistance to acknowledging this two-way influence, mainly because the folklore of thousand-year-old traditions is so useful for appeals to authority. There's a strong element of Orientalism in these attitudes.

None of this historical controversy seems very relevant to doing yoga or martial arts today. Over time people always find new ways to teach and organize physical practices, that's good not bad! Many of these traditions would have disappeared if they hadn't been modified in ways that have allowed millions of people to experience them.

Teachers who use bogus historical claims to assert their personal authority can be bad actors, but not necessarily; that's probably better judged by the quality of their teaching and practice than by the oral history they like to share.

That last point is really true.

But there was a lot of anger from the Indian yoga people that were interviewed for these books and felt like what they said was distorted.

In Goldberg's account of Krishnamacharya and his work in Mysore (which basically laid the foundation in how yoga is taught today in the West) there is an assertion that he must've seen contortionists because the deep back bends are similar to contortion. The pictures don't lie but I think the assertion is faulty.

I read K's biography/remembrance written by one of his later students (Mohan) and I gotta say there's no way he would've attended a circus show. Goldberg does say he has no evidence so its just speculation. Whereas K was probably capable of inventing deeper backbends given what children are capable of when young, and many of his students in Mysore were kids...the best thing would be to say that we don't know; there is no evidence of East-West information exchange, in that one instance.

yoga is materialism, that is all

That's right.

(Funnily enough I was going to type up a big-ish series of posts on all the yoga books I have been reading since Xmas)

This Ashtanga Vinyasa teacher gives a brief talk, tackling spiruality in materialist thinking in that somewhat annoying academic manner.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lkSNg9IET7g

Putting some notes together as I have been actually reading as much as practicing and thinking about the bigger picture of what yoga **is**...sorry this is a ramble I just need to get this out of my brain and process it out.

There is Hatha (Physical = what you do with the limbs + the breath(Pranayamas)) yoga and a philosophy attached to it. This is what differentiates it from exercise/callisthenics, even now. That you reckon with a metaphysics in an exercise class..

There are two eras, if you like:

Year 500 - 1900s: Where you have the Samkhya philosophy circulated (starting with Patanjali but its basically a dual/non-dual split, and a further split in India alongside the Brahminical/Tantra axis (which integrates with Hinduism and Buddhism too))

Alongside this you have Hatha yoga texts where the number of asanas steadily increase from four or five to about 100, from the 10th century to the 19th:

With these texts (and others like Gorakṣaśataka, which I haven't got hold of as yet, but you can read 'Roots of Yoga', which is a great Penguin compilation of all this and so much more, and a starting point for all):

- Gheranda Samhita
- Siva Samhita
- Dattatrayayogasastra
- Hatha Yoga Pradipika (the most well known of these manuals) (lots of commentaries but Krishmacharaya's is key, as I talk about further down)
- Khecarividya
- Haṭhābhyāsapaddhati

There are: NO pictures (except the odd painting and many sculptures in temples that is all the visual document we have from those times, but ofc nothing like photographic material you attached to texts today), NO detailed instructions and (apart from Haṭhābhyāsapaddhati) NO sequencing.

There are physical methods taught but these texts mostly feel like teaching aids (and ofc what were books in medieval India?) The culture was v much that these were (guesswork here) consumed in a one-to-one setting, that students were accepted (cults but a very different feel to what they are today), and that these were practices for goals beyond the mortal not mere physical wellbeing.

The physical was a path to the spiritual, which is where the notion of Chakras and Kundalini can also come in.

The Elliott Goldberg I talked about before (as well as 'Yoga Body' by Mark Singleton) goes into good detail as to the development of 'Sun Salutations', how asanas intersect with bodybuilding and physical culture and culminates with 'Light on Yoga' where the level of detail, sequencing (there are six years worth of sequences from beginner to advanced, which is the core of the book for me) and how the asanas should look in the end (as detailed by photographic material), for two hundred of them, while the number of pranayamas (breath manipulations) are static, and you only have about a dozen.

Light on Yoga was a sort of quantum leap for the documentation of Asana practice, and its what I learnt, which is at first based on what Iyengar learnt at Krishnamacharya's Shala in Mysore in the 1930s as a teen. And in between the Hatha Yoga texts and Light on Yoga there is K's work (he also published Yoga Makaranda in the 1930s, which was a fine book but nowhere as good as LofY) and chief innovation: Vinyasa, where you link the body's movements with the breath (actions on inhale and exhale, how many breaths and manipulations). Whereas Iyengar often dispensed with this, where the instruction is to "breathe normally", which is actually brilliant for most people who will struggle to even straighten and stretch their legs.

When it comes to the 1920s onwards the question often becomes: how to propagate this stuff to enough people so that you can sustainably live in the world as a householder -- yoga teacher as a job -- instead of a renunciate who would teach one-on-one (you can't make money, you don't pay rent, no societal respectability).

In a class you have students who are living in the world and who wanted yoga to feel better (healthier, etc.) as opposed to only doing the spiritual work, to attain liberation, or to learn to manipulate energies within the body (Kundalini). There might be esoteric interests but in a class setting no one has to get initiated to a sect, they just need to pay for the class and if you want to learn the esoteric stuff its highly unlikely it could be legally done in a class setting.

Its very much my sense that Kundalini, and techniques like Khechari Mudra (where you roll the tongue back against the palate and enter the nasal cavity and er, eventually attain immortality through this), or cleansings as detailed in the Hatha Yoga corpus clash with a more philosophical approach that was undertaken in Iyengar's later teaching. "Energies" are invisible, they can't be quantified (the Western mind will balk at Chakras) whereas a phiosophical framework that leads to Samadhi is -- while weird -- has a structure with which to attain it: prepare the body to sit quietly, or training to meditatively move, which can be observed by demonstration of accomplished yogis.

Throughout then there is like a gains and losses column:

Patanjali: seated practice (no more than 10 postures, probably less) leading to Samadhi, but beginning with living in a highly controlled ethical way (Yamas and Niyamas), which is highly respectable householder living in the world practice.

Hatha Yoga (up to 1920s): Physical practice (30-100 asanas documented), Pranayama, Mudras, Bandhas, cleansings to prepare for seated meditation.
Liberation is also the point but the focus is on the practices that could get you there. No Yamas and Niyamas, though the role of diet points
to a way of living which is way off the track (controlled diet, but also when, how you eat are important). Taken by ascetics/renunciates.

1920s onwards: increase in Asanas with the Vinyasa technique, Pranayama, less Mudras and Bandhas. The focus is on asana and Pranayama
to prepare different bodies that now are seated in chairs all the time so that they can sit on the floor + Patanjali-like respectability.
(Krishnamacharya's commentary of the Pradipika is funny where he is v against Khechari Mudra, and looks down on Kundalini, wild Tantric renunciate
stuff which clashes with the respectability of a Brahmin householder, which is what K was)

Light on Yoga: Further expositions of Asana and Pranayama are the core of the practice with alignment of body (which means highly detailed instruction), some Mudras and Bandhas. Acknowledgment of cleansings, meditation, Kundalini, Chakras, the yogic diet but it all feels like paying lip service to the history of Hatha Yoga whereas what's important is Asana/Pranayama and Patanjali's work. A mish-mash of Hatha and Samkhya
that began with Krishnamacharya is further extended to here by one of his students.

The only thread truly connecting it all is: Abhyasa (Practice), Tapas (heat/fire/intensity) and Vairagya (detachment/dispassion). Yoga as an intense process, which is practiced fiercely, whether 'results' come or not. In this sense, a religion-like aspect...

I want to carry on with some of Iyengar's students (or some of the people that were with him, many of whom stayed but some who left to pursue other avenues). They wrote books and reckoned with this material and went back in history. More pluses and minuses.

very cool, thanks for the info. i need to get light on yoga.

Its good for a good look though its hard to get into without a pracitce, and its a specific type of book which really shook things up. People like Sivananda (as well as his students) and Dhirendra Bhramachari had to come up with their own versions of that kind of thing (as I see it), where the focus shifted from Bhakti Yoga (in Sivananda's case) or the interesting forms of Hatha DB seemed to be going for in his first book (Yogic Suksma Vyayama) to a Light on Yoga copy, by getting some young flexible thing to do the hardest poses in the photos. What's impressive about Iyengar (without being some kind of yoga rockist) is that he was doing the hard stuff by himself into his 60s, and as his body aged he was still practicing hard poses with the help of props. The videos on YT from the mid 70s are pretty remarkable as performance theatre.

Before carrying on with some more observations I thought I'd post some more on Krishnamacharya. Like I said he wrote the Makaranda, he hated Light on Yoga -- but he had a love/hate relationship with Iyengar and its hard to not see some of this as jealousy. Other than that he was the one coming up with some of the photos and early videos and trying to propagate what he was doing. Once he was sacked from Mysore* he moved to Madras and acquired new pupils, and lived quietly. His religion/sect affiliation didn't allow him to travel outside India (unlike Iyengar he didn't break that rule) so he was confined to that. There is a video on YT of his 100th Birthday celebrations (he died a few months after that).

I was going through his essay this morning and it's really interesting to have all that knowledge squeezed into (its published online somewhere) a short number of pages.

- Salutations to the Teacher and the Eternal One

His other devoted pupil in Madras was AG Mohan, he wrote a remembrance (Krishnamacharya - His Life and Teachings), which is a beautiful book (I posted about it on ILB last year, and its an all time great yoga book, it kind of led me on this path of reading more and more yoga books despite some of their dubious qualities as prose lol I do miss reading novels)

Mohan also translated one of the two books that are in a category of their own:

- Yoga Yajnavalkya
- Lalleshwari - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lalleshwari, https://www.penguin.co.in/book/i-lalla/

The Yajnavalkya is a dialogue between husband and wife and is thought to have been written just around the time of Patanjali and before Hatha Yoga really got going. It describes the Eight Limbs of Yoga and goes through a few Asanas and Pranayamas and I think Krishnamacharya found this to be a really, really useful book.

There aren't many women in yoga in medieval India that have their own voice. Lalleshwari was different and this books of poems (which also contain yogic teachings) from a non-dual Saiva perspective are really remarkable.

*as detailed in this podcast with Ashtanga** Teacher (and Mysore researcher Andrew Eppler: https://harmonyslater.com/finding-harmony-podcast/2021/11/2/andrew-eppler)

** I won't talk that much about Ashtanga Vinyasa yoga since forms of this kind of flowing yoga are the cornestone of what's practiced in the West today. I do a lot of Jumpings and rollings in my Iyengar practice, but I need the detail otherwise you can easily get injured if you don't have the openings in the shoulders, writs, hips, hamstrings etc. Certainly encountered a few people who switched to Iyengar because they got injuries in Ashtanga, but I don't really know the practice well enough to comment. But I really like BNS Iyengar (no relation), the guy is 100 and still alive and he is still teaching. I would be tempted.

I have never formally practiced Hatha Yoga; it was always Hatha via Iyengar's method. When I started I asked my first Iyengar teacher what Hatha was an she said its 'general' yoga and while that's kind of true its more that its the physical form that its written about in the older texts. Physical Yoga as a way toward meditation, whereas Iyengar tried meditation when Krishnamacharya said to him (when he turned 60) to stop asana work and focus on seated meditation.

He did, for three months, and as he tells it this did not work for him. He needed to get back into Asanas and he never stopped till he died at 95 (he died the year I started yoga classes). Iyengar reasoned that Yoga asanas were his prayers, that you could reach all eight stages of yoga in any yoga pose; that yoga was a moving meditation; that this was Patanjali's yoga. That account does need some critique, but it was his yoga, and his path.

Anyway, the problem with Hatha is that (as I said yesterday) these were sort of manuals, and the audience could sit on the floor like we sit on furniture now, so the hips back then are healthy and the legs are used and the spine isn't hunched but straight. Poeple could squat. I spend much of my time sitting on a pillow for the last few years while working from home, so I get to use my legs. For ages it was difficult, it still is but I am getting better, and so is my practice.

The books below try to flesh out what Hatha Yoga could be. Rosen was an ex-Iyengar student but here he writes about the 32 asanas in the Gheranda Samita, and he tries to fashion a practice out of it. Theos Bernard is kind of fascinating. He wrote a manual based on his experiences of learning Hatha Yoga in the 30s (see the wiki). Lysbeth is a Belgian who tries to cut down Hatha's techniques to what is essential for Westerners, trying to deal with how the physical postures can be used in the modern day. The Bernard is the most interesting to me because he tries to fit a square into a circle by going into the techniques the most.

Richard Rosen - Original Yoga
Theos Bernard - Hatha Yoga: The Report of a Personal Experience (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theos_Casimir_Bernard)
Andre Van Lysbeth - Yoga Self-Taught

Iyengar and his yoga have propagated throughout the West, parts of Asia, Russia, South America, South Africa, Australia and Israel too. There are national associations that bear his name in about forty countries. Currently there are four levels of certification with L4 being advanced. Iyengar wrote four core books (besides Light on Yoga), his daughter Geeta wrote a book on Yoga for Women. They wrote a brilliant manual for teaching it. His pupils in the West and India are propagating and teaching what they have learnt from him without much deviation.

And then there are students who did intensives in India, or stayed with him for many years then left him, the association, its politics (as all politics it gets ugly and tiring). I went through a lot of those stories (and heard a lot of them through yoga podcasts) and some of it feels like an abusive relationship; some of it is an amicable split. The below is a sample of the books (downloaded from Anna's archive/material (podcasts and Youtube Videos; the internet is great) I have collated by the pupils. A lot of the books have been collated in the last few months and I haven't finished most of them, but have read parts.

You can read a lot of the names writing a short essay about their time with Iyengar here.
BKS Iyengar - The Yoga Master (ed. Kofi Busia). This is a collection that celebrates Iyengar's 80th (or 70th, one of those) birthday. From there you track it down.

One of those guys is Zhandor Remete, who was with Iyengar for many years and then went on to form the Shadow Yoga school.

He has written a book on it Chaya Yoga and I've started practicing it. The site is here:

https://shadowyoga.com/

There is a great podcast with one of his early students who went onto study swordmanship full time
https://www.yogapeeps.com/2008/episode-47-john-evans-audio/306

What I like about it is that it goes deep into the old texts:

https://shadowyoga.com/recommended-texts

It goes for a reconstruction of Hatha Yoga (meditation in seated postures) but recognises that the Western body can't sit on the fllows, that shoulders/wrists are fucked so you need PREPARATORY work. So from that lighbulb moment I got to collate a lot of that work, though I am taking some Shadow Yoga classes.

The video below is an example of prepatory work. Anyone who has has bad knees (or injures like I do sometimes) will appreciate the Circling movements of the limbs and how circulation is bought back:

#https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lK7GnP8kIeA

It has a series of dynamic squats like this one - if you can't squat you can't sit.
#https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DdJZTZCylTc

A lot of yoga could align (just looking at the shapes here) with dance in its controlled movement; some Yoga has squats and push ups and squats in common with Indian Martial Arts, such as Kalari. This is something that Shadow Yoga makes use of. Here are some Kalari demonstrations:
#https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_KCRgW88Emw
#https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7JqqX6vRYc0

Iyengar went through phases in his teaching. As Noelle and Donna Holleman say he used to teach a small number of students (before he achieved fame and got enough money from sales of Light on Yoga to establish his institute in Pune). They came to India and he would get them through three hours in the morning and three hours in the evening for months; the body would get stronger and flexibility would come. You can see him helping her out here (https://www.centeredyogadonaholleman.org/en/centered-yoga-en/).

Donna distanced herself from it in the 80s and then wrote a book about her own yoga.
Donna Holleman - Dancing the Body of Light

One of Iyengar's early student (who also taught Donna) was Vanda Scaravelli. You can see her doing amazing asanas well into the 80s (https://www.catherineannisyoga.co.uk/about/vanda-scaravelli-yoga/). She was taught by Iyengar (and Desikachar too). There was some sort of falling out, but from there she developed some kind of methodology which she passed on to a few students, which is called 'Scaravelli - inspired' yoga. Having read their books there are some indications as to what it could be. These are like the hints in the Indian medieval yoga books. Hints, with a lot of work to be done to discover for yourself.

Vanda Scaravelli - Awakening the Spine
Sandra Sabatini - Like A flower: my Years with Vanda Scaravelli/Breath: The Essence of Yoga
Diane Long/Sophy Hoare - Notes on Yoga: The Legacy of Vanda Scaravelli

In the book by Diane Long there are some sharp words against Iyengar's work -- especially the use of props -- which is really interesting as Iyengar developed these as students were getting neck injuries in shoulderstand, for example. It certainly led me to play with shoulderstand without a pile of blankets and its an ongoing thing in my personal practice, as the use of props (even within the Iyengar community) is something that you need to discourage students from using unless they really can't get anywhere with it at the beginning.

The best video demonstration of Scaravelli Yoga is in this yoga channel. Its very much like trying to intuitevely discover your way into a yogic posture, whereas Iyengar is v much school of hard knocks with ruthless repetition and practice, practice, practice with fire and no let up.
#https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBajK5u9jFE

Another early student is Noelle Perez-Christiaens; she was a hairdresser from Belgium and she compiled Iyengar's sayings. This is actually the thing that really captures what an amazing teacher he was and its a brilliant read.

Sparks of Divinity - The Teachings of BKS Iyengar from 1959 to 1975

So: Shadow Yoga, Scaravelli Yoga, what else? Will come back in a bit..

Thanks for these notes, xyzzzz__. For me they're very helpful in filling out the ideas in Yoga Body about the evolution of these practices in the era of mass media and Western-style pedagogy.

The video of Shadow Yoga warm-up exercises is great! Sedentary people generally aren't prepared to begin many forms of practice, and sometimes instructors don't have good tools to address that gap. Those exercises seem to meet that need well. Many people would gain significant mobility just from doing those warm-ups regularly, whether or not they went on to more challenging asanas.

Andrey Lappa, who started practicing yoga from a copy of LonY in the Ukraine in the late 80s is quite a weird character. He came up with "Universal Yoga" and runs intensives for half of the year and then the other half is spent meditating in the Himalayas. He wrote a fairly hard to read book (PDF is online) (https://www.universal-yoga.com/)

There are a few people who do some of the sequence demonstrations on YT, which combine classical asanas with Ashtanga Yoga Vinyasas. Don't particularly care for them but I think the prone shoulder openers are really good preparatory work.

The Demonstrations in this YT channel were good and I learnt it from this student of his.
#https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwJfV04vuQc

He came up with something called "shiva nata", which are these arm movements. This would take a good year to learn.
#https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yDIEqvLj018

Nicky Knoff is an Australian teacher who was a prisoner of war survivor when young (there is a podcast where she tells her story) and then went to Iyengar and then Ashtanga intensives but basically came up with "Knoff Yoga". This 'Bhumi Namaskar' sequence is another excellent preparatory sequence of sittings and squats
#https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RciVFQigvHE-

Eric Schiffmann - Yoga: The Spirit and Practice of Moving into Stillness
Eric (as he tells it in inteviews) basically would write letters to people in India/elsewhere and ask whether he could come and teach stuff. They would say yes and off he went. He met Krishnamurti, Scaravelli, Iyengar and Desikachar. Then he met an American Hatha Yogi who was pretty much self-taught -- Joel Kramer -- who wrote some terrific articles on creating energy lines to achieve proficiency in asanas. Eric has such a kind hippie vibe. His YT channel is dormant but the videos are up and in this one he talks about Iyengar and Kramer. Eric's book basically is a great mish mash of both Iyengar 'alignment' and Kramer 'energy lines' explained. Read it apart from the final section on meditation, which I'll get to next.
#https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AU-JWABImOk

Joel Kramer died a few years ago but his site is still up and the series of articles he wrote on yoga technique are really important to me - https://www.joeldiana.com/?page_id=14
He wrote a book called (The Passionate Mind Revisited) which I have but not really gone through just yet.

Ramanand Patel was a senior Iyengar teacher and sort fell off due to Iyengar Yoga Politics surrounding certification etc. He did a series of interviews (instigated by a student of his) where he talks about all sorts of yogic aspects (this was a covid type project). I pull out his chat on 'yoga and sound'; his talk on Savasana is really great too, but they are all worth a listen.
#https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xfb7tttqTHE

Simon Borg-Olivier and Bianca Machliss also learnt a lot from both Iyengar and Ashtanga. They combine a very Western approach to Anatomy, Physiology and nutrition (while paying lip service to yogic anatomy and diet in their book Applied Anatomy and Physiology of Yoga) (PDF is again online), which is not my jam as I don't care for Western anatomy as a subject but it has a great appendix on 'generating Bandhas'. Like Lappa he is one of those ppl that does a lot of workshops and there are plenty of podcasts he is on to promote them. Again don't particularly care for what he often talks about but he'll come up with something now and then. In one podcast he talks about helping out a Prof Bhim Dev in his demonstrations, and I'll end these posts by linking to this demonstration he gave on a TV talk show. Yogic magic powers

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSuWtF-MVxk

xp - no worries. I am 95% Iyengar (will be looking to teach the stuff should I pass the exam this year or next) but am now seeing some areas where my body really needs other stuff to compliment it as well.

Pretty good interview that touches on class, gender and cast between the Brahmin and Tantric approaches to yoga.

https://wildyogi.info/en/articles/tantra-there-are-no-castes-no-gender-interview-vagish-shastry

A couple more podcasts.

This is by Joel Kramer who I talk about above.

Self taught from books...just doing and discovering. He was a trained philosopher and started late.

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/podcast-yoga-peeps/id121950220

Paulie Zink was a martial artist who then found yoga. He explains how he invented Yin yoga by accident. The practice is quite far from what it's thoughts but like Iyengar it's long static holds. But it's mostly a seated practice.

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/paulie-zink-monkey-kung-fu-master-yin-yoga-founder/id1607750857?i=1000585190005

Paulie and Joel are American Yoga at its best. Just highly independent of anyone, very isolated, both never published a book. Paulie has a YT channel so you can see him in action too.