Join My Boycott of Morrissey

(unlike binjomania's post, which is just moronic)

That life is hard enough when you belong here
That life is hard enough when you belong here
Oh...
Shelve your western plans
Oh...
Shelve your western plans
’cause life is hard enough when you belong
Life is hard enough when you belong here
Oh...
Shelve your western plans
Oh...
Shelve your best friends
’cause life is hard when you belong here
Oh...
Life is hard enough when you belong

This line is so fucking galling on almost every single level; even as a roleplaying song I find this whole thing to be completely, totally loathesome and repellent.

I'm not entirely sure but I think Morrissey is the ONLY artist I've ever been a huge borderline-obsessive fan of who's recorded a song that made me actively hate him. To this day I won't purchase any of his solo recordings because I don't want my money going to him (also I am filling in my Smiths collection with used records; sorry other Smiths members for fucking with your residuals but your lead singer turned out to be one of the biggest tools in the universe).

I'm not even going to get started and the cloying "Bengali, Beh-heh-hengali" bits AAAAAAAAAAARGH what a fucking awful song.

She's an ugly girl, does it make you want to kill her?
She's an ugly girl, do you want to kick in her face?
She's an ugly girl, she doesn't pose a threat.
She's an ugly girl, does she make you feel safe?
Ugly girl, ugly girl, do you hate her
'Cause she's pieces of you?

She's a pretty girl, does she make you think nasty thoughts?
She's a pretty girl, do you want to tie her down?
She's a pretty girl, do you call her a bitch?
She's a pretty girl, did she sleep with your whole town?
Pretty girl, pretty girl, do you hate her
'Cause she's pieces of you?

You say he's a faggot, does it make you want to hurt him?
You say he's a faggot, do you want to bash in his brain?
You say he's a faggot, does he make you sick to our stomach?
You say he's a faggot, are you afraid you're just the same?
Faggot, Faggot, do you hate him
'Cause he's pieces of you?

You say he's a Jew, does it me that he's tight?
You say he's a Jew, do you want to hurt his kids tonight?
You say he's a Jew, he'll never wear that funny hat again.
You say he's a Jew, as though being born were a sin.
Oh Jew, oh Jew, do you hate him
'Cause he's pieces of you?

Okay even though I know that wasn't a serious comment I totally saw red for a second.

pathetic yes but as I say they tend to grow out of it

Momus should join a cultural studies program.

YOU WILL GET ON THE FRONT COVER OF THE SUN WITH A FUNNY HEADLINE THAT WAY

I also think you have to have seen the film "My Beautiful Launderette" to get the context for this song.

Because, you know, everyone was wearing platforms in 1994.

I really need to see the directors cut...

You know, if people said "Morrissey is a homosexual" as much as they said "Morrissey is a racist", they'd understand his work a hell of a lot better.

"Why did I come here?"

Nope. Still don't get it.

xpost

that said, though, if we're doing just-the-text, you have to really close your eyes & ears & mind super-tight to hear "when you belong here" as anything other than a finger-wagging, exclusionary, either-genuinely-racist-or-'transgressively'-racist bit of nastiness

You don't need to worry Dan, Mike Joyce has a lien on all the other members' royalties anyway!

-- Alfred, Lord Sotosy

The comparison with Pasolini would back up Momus's tormentor/lover theory. With Pasolini being run over by his bit of working class trade and all.

-- latebloomer: band to the planet mars (posercore24...), March 30th, 2006.

It's always great to get a chance to dust off some old work:

http://www.eicat.ca/~scarruthers/ilx/momussey.jpg

i suggest the former includes buck-toothed girls in luxembourg (not colour-specific), animals (seals especially), people in comas (only if girlfriends).

the latter might include race, homosexuality, whatever.

I really doubt American conservative commentators are standing up for homosexuality, the radicalization of Muslim youth, and integration rather than assimilation.

wha?

haha if memory serves: "i detest stevie wonder. i think diana ross is awful. reggae is vile."

Um, no it's not. It's about immigrant communities retaining the right to cultural difference rather then being forced to adopt the customs (or even language) of their host country.

You gotta figure that distinction eventually becomes crystal clear to anyone naive enough to fuck Morrissey or Stipe.

The "when you belong here" is supposed pretty ironic I think - Viva Hate as an album (strike that, Morrissey's songbook generally) is pretty obsessed with the notion of not belonging to England, the lie and the emptiness at the heart of it. He says the line in the same way that a prison inmate might say "I belong here".

Unlike Momus, I don't think it actually amounts to an argument for the preservation of Bengali culture. I doubt Morrissey gets that far: all he's interested in is the notion that British culture is so crap even when it's real that it's not worth being faked. I don't think he really cares about what other choices a Bengali person might have, let alone about the sort of social pressures and historical factors that might be involved in how those choices are formed. This is not because Morrissey dislikes Bengalis, but because he's not actually interested in thinking about the world as something that exists outside of his own jaundiced gaze upon it.

And I think this is why it's somewhat offensive: it subordinates the entire issue of immigration and cultural integration to Morrissey's solipsistic concerns, as if immigration policy should rise and fall on the basis of whether Morrissey's gotten enough hugs today. By setting up broader socio-economic and cultural as a limp, hastily coloured-in backdrop, the song makes him seem really shallow and meanspirited in a way that the pure wimpy me-ness of something like "Late Night, Maudlin Street" doesn't.

(also - contra Esteban - isn't his new album supposed to be basically one long confession that "yes I'm having a lot of gay sex"?)

i appreciate Momus' effort, and there are some things that make sense in there, but i can't escape the conclusion that the song is roundly indefensible. there's a growing, apparently socially-acceptable tendancy for the white middle class to sneer at the white working class in the UK, and although i don't want to be another of those pointing a disparaging finger from the throne of my more comfortable upbringing, Morrissey's clearly a smart, thoughtful guy and he should know better.

I Club Baby Seals

Need a new coat
Furry white boots
Got a 12 and a club
And we just can't lose
Head out 'fore dawn
In the cold gray light
Those infant harp puppies
Won't put up a fight
Grab a scrapple/egg sandwich
At the Seal Death Lodge
Creepin up on all fours
In white camouflage
And then the thunder
And the plunder
Is set to begin

Nothin can top The way it makes me feel
I'm here to fess up
Straight up and for real
My mind's a blank slate
As I raise my staff
That's right
I CLUB BABY SEALS

Boom! there goes one
Thud! I got two
But the stud, scud killer
Is my best mate Lou
He pops 'em in droves
Wood shampoos in the cove
Give a sea-fur booby bra to my mate
Feel a twinge of remorse
This too shall pass
Baby belly fuzz toilet paper
For my ass
There's only one thing
That'll make me quit
When they're all real dead
ya dead as shit

Nothin can top The way it makes me feel
I'm here to fess up
Straight up and for real
My mind's a blank slate
As I raise my staff
That's right
I CLUB BABY SEALS

Morrissey Must Die

oh well fefe fifi fofo fum
i smell the blood of a scumdog english bum
that limey sap needs a dirt nap
he's got to perish on paperview

for how much longer must we endure
his winey winey crappy sappy musical manure
i wanna slap that fag with a toe tag
if you wont do it then i will

morrisey must die
morrisey must......die

little green haired hags, shaped like duffel bags
all think he's the cats meow
but they'll need a brand new pin up twit
when my thirty eight goes (pow pow pow)

we should lethal needle,garrote, hang or bludgeon him
too make the world a better place
and my hyperspeed black and decker power tool
will wipe that smug look off his face

morrisey must die
morrisey must.....die

the highest court of public opinion
finds the defendant morrisey
and his swarmy skanky fanbase
guilty of transgressions against man music and nature
and hereby sentences the british bastard to death on payperview

Unlike some of you, I think that's up to the Bengali to decide.

You'd be wrong on that third point pal! Your whole "differences that make a difference" schtick is THE prevalent line from neocons here w/r/t race relations. And unless I misremember your "standing up for homosexuality" line includes the right of straight men to use the word "fag" as they fit in some ridiculous "here, I'll reclaim that abusive epithet for you" scheme: American conservatism at its finest.

"You Have Killed Me" off the new one is a terrific song by the way but his cover of "Human Being" on the b-side is kinda uneventful, Mozz may have loved David Johansen but there can only be the one David Johansen which I guess accounts for Mozz trying to turn the song into a more uptempo "Heroes" but it doesn't really work

Morrissey -'Girl Afraid, where do his attentions lie?'
Dan - 'Actually Morrissey, I think it's up to the girl to decide if she's afraid or not'.

http://www.knightfeatures.com/KFWeb/content/features/nonkffeatures/Express/GeoffBoycott/Boycott001.gif

So there are several reasons to boycott Canada.

OTFM! This is such an issue with a majority of people and their causes. They pick and choose what fits their needs the most at any given time, and "look over" other issues because it would be a truly profound stance for them to acknowledge it; and most are never willing to go the whole way. If Morrissey is going to truly stand up as a staunch animal rights activist, then he should rightly boycott about half the fucking world because most countries are negligent when it comes to said issue. The amount of violence in general against animals is appaulling. I mean does he have the strength to boycott touring the US because we breed animals specifically for the purpose of slaughterhouses, that we have them endure all levels of torture and cruel housing for certain cuts. I highly fucking doubt it. What about boycotting China for their immense animal rights negligences?

146 posts?!

Hahaha okay, I'm not sure that anything really needs to be said about this.

Morrissey -'Girl Afraid, where do his attentions lie?'
Dan - 'Actually Morrissey, I think it's up to the girl to decide if she's afraid or not'.

The best part of this is not the mind-boggingly stupid strawman argument, it's the misquoting of the lyrics.

There. Corrected.

Hand In (Wicketkeeping) Glove

William, It Was Really a Duck

Never Had No One Out Ever

*Blignaut Strikes Again

What Difference Does It Make (Using the Duckworth-Lewis Method)?

**Godfrey Evans Knows I'm Miserable Now

Last Night I Dreamt Somebody Gloved Me

I Know It's Over (because under Law 22, six balls have been bowled other than those which are not to count in the over and as the ball has become dead (see Law 23 (Dead ball)) - the umpire has called Over before leaving the wicket)

(*Zimbabwean right-hand medium-fast bowler, left-hand bat, b. 1/8/78)
(**English wicketkeeper, b. 18/8/20, d. 3/5/99)

also, can anyone tell me what these lines mean? I just don't "get" them. Is there some reference I'm not getting cuz I'm American (or cuz I'm dumb?)

A silver-studded rim that glistens
And an ankle-star that ... blinds me
A lemon sole so very high

It's not a great song...although I really do like Vini Reilly's sort of wandering guitar line that comes under the lines "life is hard enough when you belong here"...i always thought that was pretty.

As time goes on, Samuel Beckett's fascination with this game becomes clearer to me.

VLADIMIR: "Shall we bowl, Estragon?"

ESTRAGON: "Yes, let us bowl."

(They do not bowl.)

So you're saying that they're declaring?

*Nick Knight Has Opened My Eyes

Oscillate Wildly (perhaps due to there being some moisture in the air and the fielding team having worked assiduously on the ball)

(leading naturally to...)

Unplayable

**Kapil Dev At One's Elbow

(*English left-hand bat, b. 28/11/69)
(**Indian all-rounder, b. 6/1/59)

"He corresponded with Hitler's architect and fixer Albert Speer about the prison garden he had created in Spandau, and, in Little Sparta in 1982, Finlay added a series of works called Third Reich Revisited, containing references to Luftwaffe aircraft. Among the most provocative is a work based on the two shots Poussin had at a subject he called The Arcadian Shepherds, showing a group of men and a woman uncovering a tomb engraved with the Latin epigraph, Et in Arcadia Ego (I too was in Arcady). Finlay took this allegory of the futility of life and embellished it with a tank bearing SS insignia.

"He would not answer questions about his intention in subsuming symbols of the Third Reich into his art, and some critics have fought shy of endorsing his work in case something nasty about his politics was to come out of the woodwork. It seems unlikely. Like the gun barrels which pun on muscial instruments, the German regalia is part of a general metamorphosis - though it may have brought about the accusations [of fascist sympathies] which led to the loss of the Versailles commission."

-- Pete W (petershepherdwatt...), March 30th, 2006. (peterw) (later)

WHY HAVE PEOPLE BOTHERED POSTING TO THE THREAD AFTER THIS? THIS IS THE FINEST POST IN ILX HISTORY.

A silver-studded rim that glistens
And an ankle-star that ... blinds me
A lemon sole so very high

it's about platform shoes, perhaps?

-- hstencil (hstenc!...), March 30th, 2006.

i havent seen the interview, but whats so racist about saying reggae is vile?

(I'll get me coat)

2) there are already regulations in place to make sure the seals are killed quickly and humanely, though they are admittedly difficult to enforce.

3) seals are killed for their meat as well as their pelts, so as somebody else said, any country who allows the killing of animals for food is equally complicit, but you won't see him cancelling dates in the US.

4) comparing the death of baby seals to the holocaust = first one to bring up the Nazis is immediately disqualified.

From now on, I finish all my interviews like this!

i believe the point he was making was about music made by black people in the mid '80s which he had seen on Top of the Pops rather than music made by black people in general. in the same interview if my reading of the rogan book is right he also talks about his fave '60s singles some of which are by black people. y see he was all about melody.

THE COD!! WON'T SOMEONE PLEASE THINK OF THE COD!!

"seals are killed for their meat as well as their pelts"

Can you please direct me to whoever it is that distributes 350,000 butchered seals each spring? I wanna start a new restaurant in Vancouver.

Sorry, what was the question again?

o well, we'll just let him off with it then, shall we?

i'm 100% with dan here; that song is fucking vile and abhorrent on any reading. in the late eighties and early nineties, when we were in our mid-teens, one of my best mates - a bangladeshi - and i started getting into the smiths and morrissey - a little after the event, sure, but there was no escaping the pervasive influence of the bequiffed funster in the north-west of england.

and that song fucking killed it for both of us straight away. i remember him being so offended, so let-down; and how he had to try to explain to his wee sister, who was cool as fuck and wanted to be into the same music as her big brother, how this guy was actually not what we'd thought and ... god, i remember being round at his house and just thinking, fuck, this song is inexcusable, isn't it? and believe me, we tried: we were both twatty english-lit types and we spent a LOT of time trying to come up with even vaguely acceptable readings of the lyric. there aren't any. accept it: it's a nasty, bitter, shitty song, and it's the main reason i despise morrissey with such a passion today (although he is also a twat on a variety of other levels).

what i also find so unpleasant about him is the way he has never engaged with the racism debate; just dismissed it with a sneer, as if it's beneath him. the guy has a lot of fucking explaining to do, and my pal, his sister and i are still waiting.

(as an aside: it's weird seeing momus defending him. my pal and i were also enormous and at times slightly obsessive early-to-mid-period momus fans. i wonder if blackpool central music library still has the copies of "tender pervert" and "circus maximus" we ordered in specially?

not that we were illegally copying your music, momus. er ... no. promise.)

x-post to gerry: hhaahha!

Directly? how? His rubbish take surely didn't make all the mozfans become racially intolerant overnight?

exactly. he made it appear acceptable - to a certain type of total bell-end, at least - to hold and espose racist views.

morrissey is a dilettante wanker who never grapples with the issues with which he flirts - principally, i think, because he doesn't have the intellectual capacity. and this was the indie boy's hero of the eighties? jesus wept.

100% correct. And yet he also single-handedly (OK, double-handedly, with Marr) breathed life into an entire musical decade and gave hope to tens of thousands of social misfits. That's why some of us still get angry, 20 years later, when he behaves like such a twat.

He might have apologized in the intervening years but since I've never read it, I still haven't forgiven him for it; if he doesn't feel like he's done anything that would warrant giving out an apology, I don't really feel that he's done anything that warrants me giving him any of my money or time. If you feel differently, that's entirely your business.

Does it? It clearly speaks differently to you than it does to me. To me it says: "Hey, your efforts to get with the culture aren't too convincing, but who cares, the culture's not worth fitting in with anyway." It's a message from one outsider to another. Yeah, it's a bit supercilious, but for Christ's sake name me a Morrissey song that's not supercilious. You'd have to be totally cloth-eared when it comes to everything Morrissey has done to be so naive as to read that lyric as racist.

You'd have to be totally cloth-eared when it comes to everything Morrissey has done to be so naive as to read that lyric as racist.

Thanks for making my point for me!

It's very much to Morrissey's credit that he never saw the need to be accountable to the shrill NME hordes

how? how on earth is it to his credit? because morrissey is somehow morally superior to everybody else in the world? hellfire, even if that were the case, he still has a duty to engage with the criticisms he has brought upon himself.

but hey, i'll remember that if i ever find myself accused of anything. "sorry, your honour, it's to my credit that i don't bother to say anything, because i think you look like a tit in that wig."

JUST FUCKING SAY "I'M SORRY PEOPLE WERE OFFENDED, THAT WASN'T WHAT I MEANT" IS IT THAT HARD TO BE A DECENT HUMAN BEING?????

Okay I'm really done now.

Well yeah, of course you can rip anything out of context and make it sound however you want. For example, totally out of context, you might well think that a band that called itself Joy Division and then became New Order might be horrifically fascist, wouldn't you? OF COURSE CONTEXT IS IMPORTANT! And just about anyone listening to Bangali in Platforms is going to know something about Morrissey, the Morrissey persona, the Morrissey songwriting style, etc etc.

Dear Hog, Please Help Me

Waugh is A Four Letter Word

Didn't he live in his room at his mom's until he was like 28? He's really projecting.

jesus christ almighty, my friend, that's one of the lamest fucking comments i've seen in my ten years on the internet. also: "white liberals"? are you 100% sure about this? you know the colour/race/creed etc of every single poster on this thread, do you?

johnny jarvis and dan's last posts sum things up perfectly.

Maybe Morrissey being the child of immigrants has a better idea of what it's really like.

and these people are where on this thread? i certainly wouldn't feel the first; nor have i ever assumed the second to be the case. however, part of the reason for that is racist arseholes bandying about loaded phrases such as "when you belong here".

oh, come on. a lot of what he writes is facile. he's got the emotional intelligence of a 14-year-old.

if this is really what he believes, then he's an even bigger pillock than i thought, and should probably not be allowed into the wider community, both for his sake and everybody else's.

A 14-year old has very complicated emotions - and it is these types of emotions that Morrissey expresses in his songs.

yeesh.

http://www.st*rmfr*nt.*rg/archive/t-134912

okay, yes, i agree.

-- grimly fiendish (simonmai...), March 31st, 2006 10:50 AM.

C'mon now, you know only white people are on the Internet.

Someone should remake "Bengali in Platforms" but address it to Irish immigrants ("Paddy in Waistcoat"?), maybe he'd get it then. Yeah, Morrissey's the defender of outsiders - but he's also got a streak of snobbery in him and he's not too careful where he points it.

How is that to Morrissey's credit, by the way? Is it noble to not answer objections to one's statements? If so, you must be a big fan of Scott McClellan, eh?

It just seems lame is all - "ah well, at least he didn't answer people who had a perfectly valid complaint! Dig in yer heels there, Mozz old boy - don't succumb to the urge to justify yourself!" rather a childish approach to the world eh wot

Platforms are specifically English (or were, back in '91)?

"Driving Your Girlfriend to the Boundary"

"The Harsh Truth Of The Camera, Hawkeye"

"Hold On To Your Catches"

"Ben Hollioake In Platforms"

http://netmode.vietnamnet.vn/dataimages/original/images383525_seal_heidi_klum.jpg

go fuck yourself, preferably with a spiked bat.

FREE NFLD

Oh I do wish that I had to hand the exact letter I wrote to Melody Maker (got published) about Morrissey not being a racist back after that Frank Owen interview, as not liking the '80s incarnations of Wonder and Ross were not indicative of racial prejudice but rather a preference for Tamla/Motown and Holland/Dozier/Holland (I followed that up by writing an essay for a Smiths zine urging them to buy Public Enemy records if they wanted a status report on American outsiders for ONE example). I do believe there is a far more prosaic, pedantic and smartarse reason that Morrissey feels he could not be considered a racist, but I will not say what it is until I ask him myself.

I can totally sympathise with anyone who objects to this song who has themselves tried and succeeded to write in character of someone of another skin colour, background or ability, and hasn't felt like a dick for even trying. For me, it's a song about as equal in crapitude as Nick Hornby trying to write from a female POV: klutzy, but not in the Ism League, much more 'naive liberal'. And the fact of the matter is that Morrissey refused to answer the debate with the music inkies because last stop for anything he said would have been on the editorial desk of a thoroughly objectionable man with a skinhead who never liked his records in the first place, and had papers to sell from the debate (it was also one of the few times an amazing, black NME writer was allowed to write at length instead of that editor treating him like a mad person with nothing to offer). There are often really boring reasons why people cannot get answers they feel somehow entitled to and this one's King Boring, but I hope illuminating.

From what I am given to understand it was a bit crap being an Irish immigrant; discrimination in jobs and accomodation abounded (and M's family seems to have been no exception) so despite the totally clumsy lyrics I honestly think that in his naivete he was talking about something he and his relations had experienced (including the part about being condescended to). It's going to become interesting to hear from Irish who were subjected to the same shit in the '70s ("ooh, a terrorist!" thinks Daily Mail reader when hearing Irish voice) as Muslims are today - parallels abound.

Most white British people in 1988 could not distinguish a (West) Bengali from a Bangladeshi from a Pakistani, particularly if they were from Oop North (both were, of course, "Pakistani" from '47-'71). What you've got to realise is that in the late '80s when the song was written, as Nick says way upthread, My Beautiful Laundrette rocked A LOT of people's worlds at a time when people were interested in ALL ramifications of post-Colonial culture for the first time (there was also Rushdie, Ishiguro, Isaac Julien all cross-pollenating with these art/music biz stately homos) and it was like the second wave of Angry Young Person. A door opened, and 'difference' started to be explored in leaps and bounds in Britain, but what people soon realised was that our similarities were pretty fucking AS ONE under the skin and well, that's OK 'cos we ALL hate Margaret Thatcher...anyway, you get the drift.

are you afraid that they will find out that they had lunch with you?

well, i'm not afraid of cornershop. cornershop! cornershop! cornershop!

It would actually be helpful to respond in some way to the great big whacking post I made rather than the one about yesterday's lunch. Also, and I think relevantly, fancying skinheads makes you a white British gay man over 40, not a racist.

OK.

A letter I wrote (got published) won my mom Bellmore Life's Mother-of-the-Year 1981. Well, second place.

What I said was that just because Morrissey has skinhead fantasies doesn't mean he's gained any great moral insight from them. To elaborate a little, I don't think such fantasies necessarily compel a person to think one way or the other about skinheads or relationships of power. Or racism, for that matter.

I am from Newfoundland, and I know first hand that people in rural areas in Eastern Canada live off the land, not off reguritating the same fucking garbage up for over two decades for a legion of sorry ass closeted homosexuals and wankers. His pathetic whining has gone on for too long now.

As for seals (baby seals included) being clubbed to death - that simply isn't true. The majority of seals are killed through hunting guns. Lots of animals die everyday, I think Morrissey is picking the wrong battle.

Also, here is a poster highlighting how ethnocentric Morrissey's arguement is, especially pertaining to Native peoples of Canada. Morrissy IS A RACIST!
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v348/lewk_pook/60317-page3.jpg

They got little hands
Little eyes
They walk around
Tellin' great big lies
They got little noses
And tiny little teeth
They wear platform shoes
On their nasty little feet

Well, I don't want no Short People
Don't want no Short People
Don't want no Short People
`Round here

Short People are just the same
As you and I
(A Fool Such As I)
All men are brothers
Until the day they die
(It's A Wonderful World)

Short People got nobody
Short People got nobody
Short People got nobody
To love

They got little baby legs
That stand so low
You got to pick 'em up
Just to say hello
They got little cars
That go beep, beep, beep
They got little voices
Goin' peep, peep, peep
They got grubby little fingers
And dirty little minds
They're gonna get you every time
Well, I don't want no Short People
Don't want no Short People
Don't want no Short People
'Round here

I'm not really interested in Morrissey anymore, but I think his main problem is that he credits his fans with more intelligence than perhaps some of them have. I guess some of them are unable to see the different layers & interpretations present in some of his more ..er.. "open to interpretation" lyrics. Randy had to SPELL IT OUT to people (see above lyric) and *still* some of them didn't get it (didn't "Short People" get banned in a few states?).

Maybe all artists should just assume everyone's an idiot & not use their art to explore ideas? Yes, judging by some of the reactions on this thread, that's exactly what they should do.

Well if getting your politics sorted out means you end up supporting a murderous Labour government just because they are "Labour" I'd prefer not to have mine sorted out either.

but morrissey is still VERY OLD NEWS and has FRANKLY SHODDY since THE EIGHTIES.

This is lame rank-pulling. Do you really think that only "minorities" (whoever you think that should encompass - simply everyone who is non-white?) should be allowed to adjudicate on what is offensive and what is not? In any case I'm assuming you're not Bengali - so why are you suddenly an expert on what Bengalis may or may not find offensive?

Perhaps people would prefer the knuckle-knawingtedium of the likes of Billy Bragg, but at least there'd be no misunderstandings.

hah! fwiw, musically i'd far rather listen to billy bragg's "don't try this at home" than anything morrissey has ever been involved with.

as for "short people" and "bengali in platforms": the difference is that one is an acerbic piece of social commentary written by a wordsmith of wit and intelligence, and the other is a bad joke by an arsehole.

Yet some people still see it as an attack on the Southern mentality, while others are shocked by his use of taboo words. I'm not saying that Morrissey is as witty or intelligent a writer as Randy, but I am saying that anybody's lyrics are open to misinterpretation.

And you're right about Don't Try This At Home, it is a great record. I'm more of a tunes guy myself, don't much care about lyrics. Just as well, when you consider the line "Just because you're gay, I won't turn you away". Well, Bill, that's very decent of you, thanks very much.

You know, Luke, what Moz said was stupid, but this is worse. People who remain closeted have their reasons, and I'm surprised at your callousness. Not everyone comes careening out of the closet at birth, but I'm glad it was so easy for you.

And what's wrong with a good wank, exactly?

He also quotes BGCSISDAW in The Smiths' "Well I Wonder".

Ms Smart and Ms Mitchell are, of course, both Canadian.

Is there a review of 'Ringleader', (surely to be sold with a sticker saying "His Most Uranist Album Yet") that DOESN'T quote those lyrics from "Dear God Please Help Me" alluding to legs? Apart from mine in Plan B magazine, obviously.

He's still the most interesting artist in the big league pop world.

i can instantly see four things potentially wrong with this sentence

I always want to go up to Bragg after a show and force him to prove this.

"Just because you're gay, I won't turn you away
Unless you get your nob out, I might just get you carried out..".

It may reference Elizabeth Smart, but also Bill Naughton & Carry On Teacher. Anyhow, it's a fine track on a fine album: Morrissey's best, I would say. Bengali is weak, Margaret on the G is weaker, but as a whole it's far more interesting than Vauxhall & I, AND, dare I say, streets ahead of anything the Smiths would have come up with had they stayed together.

As to the argument raging above I will happily admit it's a hell of a lot easier to give Morrissey the benefit of the doubt re: bigotry if you're of European descent or othered in ways similar to those he evokes in songs. I suppose to understand what Dan et al might be feeling, you might borrow a different set of words (Guardian MLK obit) about the loss of another kind of hero which express the same sort of bereft disappointment: 'This is a day when even one's Harlem friends look the other way or act as though their grief is private; they have lost someone related to them, but not to you.'

*Ken Graveney/ b. 16.12.24/ Right-arm fast-medium bowler, left-hand bat/ Gloucestershire
*Tom Graveney/ b. 16.6.27/ Right-hand bat/ England, Gloucestershire, Queensland, Worcestershire
*David Graveney/ b. 2.1.53/ Slow left-arm orthodox bowler, right-hand bat/ Durham, Gloucestershire, Somerset

someone probably made that joke already

82.

My Peter Frampton line was pretty good, I think.

Man, I kind of got into it with people on this thread.

I rescind all my previous defenses of his politics, he's clearly round the right-wing reactionary racist bend at this point.

(Defenses which i appear to have made in some other thread)

tom d swapping cricket puns with esteban buttez, ilx really hasn't changed haha

There used to be this quite common discourse in the 80's whereupon anyone finding Morrissey an unbearable hack and feeling instinctively that he was very bad, weren't quite "getting it" or something. It is weaker now, but I still sense the same idiotic wankers these days!