Bill Douglas' "Trilogy" & Naming Houses/Cars - C or D?

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So is Bill Douglas' autobiography (Own Way Home, My Ain Folk, and the other one) brilliant? Is it as good as, or better, than Sweet Sixteen which I saw at the weekend and thought was phenomenal (may expand on ilx about this but maybe not since I'm working it into my Scotland - An Address)?

Also, naming your house, or your car (Fifi the Fiesta etc) - classic or dud?

(Fed up with the single heart threads).

Also, how do you know you're not a replicant?

david h (david h), Friday, 11 October 2002 18:38 (twenty-three years ago)

not seen "sweet sixteen" but the bill douglas trilogy is painfully beautiful. it's just wonderful - stark, bleak, angry. you can see why douglas routinely pissed off the crew during the making of the film trying to exactly recreate the misery of his childhood. also quite sweet - if not also a little obsessive - he waited for stephen archibald to EXACTLY age enough to play him in national service. a series of films with images that really never leave me, ever, and are easily among the most wonderful cinematic experiences of my life... classic, classic in every way

commonswings, Friday, 11 October 2002 21:35 (twenty-three years ago)

one year passes...
A shame that these films are practically nowhere to be found... I'd really like to see them.

Does Douglas stand alongside Terence Davies particularly, in the annals of British film? Possibly with Ken Loach as well... a grouping very much opposed to the more stylistically demonstrative Jarman-Greenaway-Russell-Roeg type line... I really need to see more of these various directors. Have seen a few Roeg and Loach films, but strangely not one of the others above I mention.

Tom May (Tom May), Monday, 23 February 2004 03:04 (twenty-two years ago)

Actually the Douglas childhood trilogy is out on video. Which is tempting, but they should be on DVD.

Tom May (Tom May), Monday, 23 February 2004 03:09 (twenty-two years ago)

haha wtf is up with the second half of this thread title?

I re-saw this recently. in the cinema. the first one is stunning. there's not a single panning shot until the last half of the last film. this is how douglas manages to manipulate his town's geography so well.

cozen (Cozen), Monday, 23 February 2004 03:19 (twenty-two years ago)

no panning shots: douglas cuts quickly between two disparate locales (say, a mine and then lush fields) containing the same young boy. it gives the geography of the film an alien feel, because there is no 'movement' between the two scenes you have no sense of scale or place and so your conception of time is all you have to go on. this creates some queasy effect. I love the first film so much.

cozen (Cozen), Monday, 23 February 2004 03:21 (twenty-two years ago)

I have it on video too : / but it's not as good as the cinema. even if I did almost retreat wearily from the iffy print they showed.

cozen (Cozen), Monday, 23 February 2004 03:22 (twenty-two years ago)

haha, dude, it's better than sweet sixteen. tho ss made me cry.

cozen (Cozen), Monday, 23 February 2004 03:23 (twenty-two years ago)

the scene where the young boys fight and the gran who looks so tired pleads with them to stop is amongst the saddest in cinema.

cozen (Cozen), Monday, 23 February 2004 03:25 (twenty-two years ago)

in that cinema. and all other cinemas that it's shown.

cozen (Cozen), Monday, 23 February 2004 03:26 (twenty-two years ago)

i want to see the douglas trilogy more than almost any other films

it's on video in the uk, maybe i'll just order them

amateur!st (amateurist), Monday, 23 February 2004 10:21 (twenty-two years ago)

i hope these films live up to the impressions of them i'm forming in my head

amateur!st (amateurist), Monday, 23 February 2004 10:22 (twenty-two years ago)

Exeter University Library has all Bill Douglas' old stuff in the, ahem, Bill Douglas Museum Of Film & Popular Culture. Come and visit!

Sick Nouthall (Nick Southall), Monday, 23 February 2004 10:25 (twenty-two years ago)

Being quite serious - I'll show you round. My mate Danny works there.

Sick Nouthall (Nick Southall), Monday, 23 February 2004 10:26 (twenty-two years ago)

yeah i hear like some of my mates he collected precinema stuff, magic lanterns and zoopraxographs etc

amateur!st (amateurist), Monday, 23 February 2004 10:27 (twenty-two years ago)

has anyone seen his final feature film?

amateur!st (amateurist), Monday, 23 February 2004 10:27 (twenty-two years ago)

We've got all the zoopraxographs and magic boxes and zoetropes and stuff. And Charlie Chaplin's first ever suit.

Sick Nouthall (Nick Southall), Monday, 23 February 2004 10:28 (twenty-two years ago)

whats his final feature? "Comrades"- that film about the Tolpuddle Martyrs? that contains lots of magic lantern/ sihouette things etc. Why cant TV show this sort of thing any more? the film was actually financed by channel 4, a depressing thought when you look at the channel now.

jed_ (jed), Monday, 23 February 2004 13:47 (twenty-two years ago)

also naming houses/cars, DUD.

jed_ (jed), Monday, 23 February 2004 13:49 (twenty-two years ago)

unless you live in the country then its ok to name your house i suppose.

jed_ (jed), Monday, 23 February 2004 13:56 (twenty-two years ago)

I didn't think I loved the stilted acting. but I do. I don't know what's different between 'night of the hunter' (which I'm a bit down on for the acting) and this (which I love for the acting). noth was made in the 50s though => I expect acting standards of children were generally pretty low-grade? whereas, by extension, this would make the acting (or the director's choice of actors) in bdtrilogy 'affected'. that is, it's unbelievable to think that the first was filmed in 1972. what was he up to, the genius?!

cozen (Cozen), Monday, 23 February 2004 23:02 (twenty-two years ago)

acting is complicated

i like a lot of films with 'stagy' acting, that is, acting that has a ritualistic or hieratic quality; in fact i almost prefer this mode of acting to anything that's come in the past 40 years.

of course there are bad examples of any type of acting, and even the best directors can employ their customary style of acting in a way that misses the mark, but...

what i'm trying to say is that when people say a movie has 'stilted' acting i sort of vaguely suspect that i won't feel the same, but there are plenty of exceptions

amateur!st (amateurist), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 09:06 (twenty-two years ago)

I had to look up hieratic. the acting in this film isn't like that. it's, um, hard to describe. I moaned on another thread that some of the lines from casablanca irked me because they were delivered like readymades, shot out of bogarde's mouth in quick breath, this isn't the problem here. it's almost un-acting. sorry I shouldn't characterise this as a problem, I love it. it gives the film its jagged feeling. that and the geography editing I mentioned above. I worry that I get too bogged down in talking about these kinds of things and thinking about film in these terms. this is a throwback to infatuation with character, motive, potrayal and intents I think.

I would be surprised if you weren't surprised by the acting in BDT. I can't wait till you see it.

cozen (Cozen), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 22:24 (twenty-two years ago)

(haha as an aside - 'un-acting'. one of my most embarassing memories is trying to impress my tutor at a post-tutorial drink by telling him the kind of music I wanted to make (haha at the time pavement styled alt.rock!!!) required that I 'un-learn the guitar'. this was all tenuously linked into de sousa santos' thesis about 'unthinking law' which I shant go into here.)

cozen (Cozen), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 22:28 (twenty-two years ago)

I suspect, though may be wrong, douglas' actors managed to 'unlearn' *cringe* their craft by never learning it at all. I am talking specifically about the two young boys here. the gran is phenomenal. one of my favourite 'characters' from all of film. all of that film and all the other films.

cozen (Cozen), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 22:30 (twenty-two years ago)

I'm glad you stick around to talk about films amateurist.

cozen (Cozen), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 22:31 (twenty-two years ago)

didn't know anyone who'd heard of the trilogy before GFT showing, this is exciting. i'm new to ilx but i like what i see *but you sound like a twat*

joan (joan), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 22:40 (twenty-two years ago)

haha wait who sounds like a twat?

cozen (Cozen), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 22:42 (twenty-two years ago)

its not like friendster shit where you just declare you ideal-self and hope that someone comes along who falls for it, which is good but...

joan (joan), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 22:44 (twenty-two years ago)

maybe you already know the rest of this sentence

joan (joan), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 22:44 (twenty-two years ago)

I'm confused.

we could talk about the film?

twatzen (Cozen), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 22:45 (twenty-two years ago)

let's talk about gran

joan (joan), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 22:46 (twenty-two years ago)

the bit where the boys are fighting and she's wailing and then when she's in bed: 'my poor girls'

joan (joan), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 22:47 (twenty-two years ago)

did you like gran? what's to like.

I think people look saddest when they just sit there. and have a face that looks like that. people can look sadder when they move too, or when they die, or when they fall. but sadder when they just sit there. by a fire! I do sound like a twat.

how lonely she must feel. she looks lonely. her looks are lonely.

cozen (Cozen), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 22:50 (twenty-two years ago)

I wish I knew more about this film. normally I think I'd dislike the english person at the end of the last film, there's some things he does, I can't remember exactly, but I remember the impression of quite liking him.

cozen (Cozen), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 22:51 (twenty-two years ago)

stuart murdoch was at this screening.

cozen (Cozen), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 22:52 (twenty-two years ago)

i know, he was at the free gig at the art school that i was dragged along to afterwards as well (i was with him)

joan (joan), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 22:53 (twenty-two years ago)

oh. I saw him there too. hex? I waved to him near the beginning, so perhaps you've seen me.

cozen (Cozen), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 22:54 (twenty-two years ago)

anyway the film.

cozen (Cozen), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 22:55 (twenty-two years ago)

this thread is too pally.

call me a cunt.

cozen (Cozen), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 22:55 (twenty-two years ago)

(i've been lying to you so the pally-ness isn't a problem)

i loved the english guy, he was so paternal; how he walked off and left douglas in the sand as if to "teach him a lesson"

joan (joan), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 22:56 (twenty-two years ago)

haha!

is there a print of the last film in colour? my memories all point to it being in colour. but it just isn't, is it? where did I get this idea from?

I'm just typing for the sake of it now. out.

cozen (Cozen), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 22:59 (twenty-two years ago)

cozen are you pissed?

Sick Nouthall (Nick Southall), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 22:59 (twenty-two years ago)

(cinemania - remember the one who was on a constipatory diet to stop him having to run out of the film) what??

joan (joan), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 22:59 (twenty-two years ago)

no, I'm not pissed. why d'you ask?

haha yeh. wtf.

cozen (Cozen), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 23:00 (twenty-two years ago)

i think of the third film, the dessert, in colour too...can anyone correct us?

douglas's bag was green, they were tanned (douglas a little red), the books he borrowed, the church they were in, the child who stared in to the back of the truck smiling...it WAS in colour, fie

joan (joan), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 23:05 (twenty-two years ago)

I seem to remember being stunned that it wasn't in colour. and in fact remember the only bit in colour (garish hand-painted still!) is the beginning of the second film (jam jars as payment into the cinema!) with the quick shot of lassie (??).

cozen (Cozen), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 23:07 (twenty-two years ago)

imdb scout reveals: 'my way home - color: black & white'.

cozen (Cozen), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 23:09 (twenty-two years ago)

now i'll sleep!

thanks for this

bye

(not sure if we're supposed to say bye...is that too 'pally'?)

joan (joan), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 23:14 (twenty-two years ago)

so...naming houses and cars?

jed_ (jed), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 23:22 (twenty-two years ago)

Never owned either, so I haven't.

Sick Nouthall (Nick Southall), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 23:24 (twenty-two years ago)

My iPod's called AusPishFish though.

Sick Nouthall (Nick Southall), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 23:24 (twenty-two years ago)

haha! naming houses and cars is dud I think.

the grannie is jean taylor smith. who was also in 'crossroads' and played a grannie in 4 of her 8 movies. she's credited as being a 'grandmother' on the douglas films but a grannie on the others?!

the cut and shut nature of the film I was talking about could be seen I suppose as impressionism. dispensing with 'the conventional trappings of exposition'. I can use phrases like that, joan's gone. the way this is filmed is a brilliant analogue of one of the main themes, I suppose: the scant supply of communication. it's something I recognise from my own childhood in scotland. one deprecatingly parochial part of me wants to say this is a scottish failing, but I think that's terribly short-sighted. the bfi mini-essay I have on the film emphasises the 'bleak monochrome images' of the film but I'm still sold on the cutting as main locator of my 'startling physical sense' of newcraighill.

I completely forgot my favourite scene of the first movie: when the older brother runs up onto the bridge ahead of the steam train and dance's in the wake of steam! : D

my flatmate says the english guy reminds him of nick drake. I think I can see it. there's definitely something 'post-colonial' about nick drake. whatever that means.

cozen (Cozen), Tuesday, 24 February 2004 23:25 (twenty-two years ago)

do you ever watch a movie a million times before you even stop to think that a certain effect had to be *achieved*? i.e. in 'distant voices, still lives' the actors so thoroughly and passionately incarnate their characters that i've lived with the film for some seven years and only recently have begun to think about how this increidble empathy might have actually been arrived at

that's the kind of acting i like

amateur!st (amateurist), Wednesday, 25 February 2004 10:55 (twenty-two years ago)

two weeks pass...
joan should come back.

amst should see these movies.

I should shut up.

cozen (Cozen), Sunday, 14 March 2004 02:42 (twenty-two years ago)

hello cozen,

iwas listening all along

joan (joan), Monday, 15 March 2004 21:58 (twenty-two years ago)

hello.

cozen (Cozen), Monday, 15 March 2004 22:22 (twenty-two years ago)

so, you're going to live in edinburgh?

joan (joan), Monday, 15 March 2004 22:25 (twenty-two years ago)

and the last film i saw was 'tales of the taira clan', a Mizoguchi film

joan (joan), Monday, 15 March 2004 22:27 (twenty-two years ago)

ha um well maybe edinburgh yes. in that I've applied for a job. have you lived in edinburgh?

'tales of the taira clan' on... video?

cozen (Cozen), Monday, 15 March 2004 22:37 (twenty-two years ago)

yep on video, haven't been to the cinema in a long time, things need to change...what's on in glasgow, i haven't even looked?

joan (joan), Monday, 15 March 2004 22:41 (twenty-two years ago)

haha we should take this to aim or msn or email btw instead of 'cluttering' up the thread - but. nothing much really. gft is spartan. they got godard every sunday this month and had a couple of mizoguchi's, apart from that -.

cozen (Cozen), Monday, 15 March 2004 22:43 (twenty-two years ago)

what's aim?

joan (joan), Monday, 15 March 2004 22:45 (twenty-two years ago)

everything just went a bit funny so i emailed you, no need now though

joan (joan), Monday, 15 March 2004 22:58 (twenty-two years ago)

what IS aim? anyone?

joan (joan), Monday, 15 March 2004 22:59 (twenty-two years ago)

AIM

Ned Raggett (Ned), Tuesday, 16 March 2004 01:55 (twenty-two years ago)

two years pass...
The Douglas Trilogy (prefaced by a documentary) is being shown tonight on the digital channel Artsworld... good job I gave more than a cursory look through the Radio Times!

Tom May (Tom May), Saturday, 10 February 2007 11:01 (nineteen years ago)

That's great news, but the last time I saw the Trilogy it nearly killed me with bleakness.

I Tried to Use My Cock as a Bong (noodle vague), Saturday, 10 February 2007 11:56 (nineteen years ago)

two years pass...

http://lanternamagicka.blogspot.com/

exciting!

Tuesday, June 09, 2009
Comrades DVD - Details
According to the Bill Douglas Centre website, the DVD/BluRay of Comrades will include:

* Lanterna Magicka - Bill Douglas & the Secret History of Cinema (2009, 60 minutes), an insightful new documentary on Douglas' life and work
* Visions of Comrades (2009, 15 mins), cast-members recall making the film
* Bill Douglas interviews (1978, total 33 mins), exclusive presentation of a remarkable interview in which Douglas discusses his method and creating approach to writing and directing
* Home and Away (Michael Alexander, 1974, 31 mins), charming short film co-scripted by Douglas
* News report from the set of Comrades
* Original Comrades trailer
* Fully illustrated booklet including new essay, visual materials, archive Q&A with Bill Douglas, biography, cast and credits
* PCM stereo audio (48k/24bit on Blu-ray / 48k/16bit on DVD) (extras Dolby Digital 640kbps)

So that's well over two hours of extras, including our own contribution! Visions of Comrades is Andy Kimpton-Nye's selection of outtakes from his 2006 doc about Bill; the interviews are Charles Rees's 2009 edit of his 1978 material (which we use about 4 minutes of in Lanterna; Home and Away is a BFI-produced film that Bill co-wrote; the news report is possibly ITN (there is at least one Comrades news report in their archives - we considered using it in Lanterna); and of course the trailer, which I've never seen. Louise's essay on Bill, first published in the booklet to the Trilogy DVD, will be reprinted in the booklet of Comrades as well. All in all, a bumper package.
Posted by A Disciple of Roger Bacon at 21:27 0 comments

jed_, Sunday, 14 June 2009 22:44 (sixteen years ago)

one year passes...

this could only be a cozen thread - read it and you'll see what I mean

conrad, Monday, 20 December 2010 19:25 (fifteen years ago)

seven months pass...

Comrades is really something.

jed_, Wednesday, 10 August 2011 21:39 (fourteen years ago)

Really? I need to see that still. I have been playing around with a piece of writing on the trilogy for years, should do something with it. These are such great films.

Elderflower Gimcrax Flores (admrl), Wednesday, 10 August 2011 22:03 (fourteen years ago)

great, i don't doubt but i had a hard time getting through first two and have never watched the third. But Comrades is a very singular film, well worth tracking down, adam.

jed_, Wednesday, 10 August 2011 22:07 (fourteen years ago)


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