S/D: Sports Movies!

Another question: which sports movie is most likely to make the typical North American male tear up - Rudy, Brian's Song, or Field of Dreams?

Though neither are bad as Days of Thunder. That's a terrible movie.

Of the listed ones: I like Field of Dreams and Bull Durham best, despite not especially liking Kevin Costner. (He's probably perfect casting for FoD, though, but only because of the ways it's changed from the short story/book.)

Bad News Bears gets a nostalgia vote. And it's a lot less Disneyfied than most kids' sports movies.

I was surprised by how much I liked The Replacements -- and a little less surprised that I didn't like Any Given Sunday, which came out close to the same time, much at all.

Baseball movies: Search Major League, destroy sequels. Destroy Summer Catch, Babe. Search The Natural (again, not quite the same as the book), Damn Yankees. Search Meet John Doe and Brewster's Millions for Movies That Aren't About Sports But Have Baseball Players As Protagonists.

Kevin Costner: why is he in so many sports movies?

And jess brings in the point of animal sports films. What about the one with the mule on the football team? Wasn't Johnny Unitas in one of those? What the hell? And there's always things like Like Mike to deal with...

Also, he's pretty bland, and doesn't have any one role he's so strongly associated with that people'll go, "Yeah, I thought the movie was all right, but I couldn't look at Costner without thinking of him in A Perfect World."

So basically it just boils down to the fact that the movie was cast with rangeless actors. Give them the right roles and they're really good (Costner in Bull Durham, Liotta in GoodFellas) but they're still just playing themselves.

I really, really wish they'd been able to make the movie with John Steinbeck instead of Terrence Mann, so we could talk about the weirdness of trying to imagine Darth Vader writing Catcher in the Rye.

Which movie has more people who kind of play themselves all the time: GoodFellas or Field of Dreams? Or Henry V - I like to imagine Kenneth Branaugh always acts like a Shakespearean.

Destroy: Best in Show

SALINGER! Salinger wrote Catcher in the Rye. They're both J.S.'s. But now I can't remember which one was in Shoeless Joe.

My high school English teacher has just rescinded my diploma, I'm sure.

Which movie has more people who kind of play themselves all the time: GoodFellas or Field of Dreams? Or Henry V - I like to imagine Kenneth Branaugh always acts like a Shakespearean.

I think FoD should win because it has the most variety of people playing themselves, or at least playing barely-there bland people. The Goodfellas guys are all playing themselves, but they're all similar enough that if one guy broke a leg in some movie, the producers could try to get one of the others to fill in for em -- but James Earl Jones will never, ever take over a role for Kevin Costner (and not just because of the race thing).

Though neither are bad as Days of Thunder. That's a terrible movie.

!!! Terrible in the best way! And Duvall is great, as usual.

even Burt Lancaster (Doc/Moonlight/Archie) isn't exactly known for his range

?!?!?!?!!!

?!?!?!?!!!

It doesn't make him a bad actor. MOST actors working under the studio system weren't known for their range -- the studios didn't want them to have range.

J.D. Salinger was the writer. You had the right book, wrong name. It's ok. I think they're both crap, so it's no difference to me. But Terrence Mann is meant to be J.D. Salinger...

It was just on TV tonight by the way, which is what started up my discussions of sports movies. That and The Cutting Edge, which stars DB Sweeney, and it reminded me of 8 Men OUt.

And I agree with that last point - having limited range isn't necessarily something that makes them bad actors. I mean, think of John Wayne. Or DeNiro! I keep saying this and everyone gets pissed off at me, especially living in NYC. I'm not saying he's not fantastic but really, could you imagine Robert DeNiro playing Indiana Jones or something?

(x-post with Ally)

I've always wondered to what extent that's true. I wish I still had my notes from my "Baseball and Myth" class (best class ever) when we discussed the differences between the movie and the book -- there are so many, in terms of tone and ... level of cynicism ... that it's hard for me to tell if the differences between Mann and Salinger (ha!) actually make them different characters, so to speak, or are just part of the overall feel-good-ification of the movie.

Search: The Program. All animals playing sports movies. Cool Runnings. Also Youngblood! ("Wanna go, prettyboy?")
Destroy: Caddyshack

I make it a rule never to bring up Monty Python or The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy among strangers, because I never know when I'll have to sit through thirty minutes of quotes interspersed with "wasn't that the funniest?"/"no, it was funnier when ..."

It doesn't make him a bad actor. MOST actors working under the studio system weren't known for their range -- the studios didn't want them to have range.

All Movie Guide on Burt Lancaster - second sentence begins "Boasting an impressively wide range, "

Didn't that yachting movie also star Matthew Modine?

Ron Shelton (Bull Durham, White Men Can't Jump) made the best sports movies. I even like Tin Cup, but that's only because I watched it for 20 minutes @ a time over the course of 10 days - were I to sit thru it, I'd go nuts, ESPECIALLY @ the end.

Actually I like the book better (movie is pretty hollywoodized). It was a great book for its time; a sports star admitting mental problems back then is tantamount to a sports star coming out today (even if the book itself is admittedly grade-school reading level). Jimmy Piersall is one of my all-time favorite favorite sports stars. The guy is a piece of work, god bless him.

In fact, Tad stole my answer. Surely Slapshot is the best sports movie evah.

Maybe this isn't a problem internal to the film (I mean the premise is the same as Spinal Tap) as much as the band-fan phenomenon discussed above.

I mean, I like Waiting for Guffman, too, but I find some of the bits just boring or even mean, like "oh funny, Parkey Posey is a hick and she has a great idea for a new Dairy Queen product, oh hilarious, you're kiling me, thank god I'm not her." Well maybe I'm just sensitive because it's a little too close to home in both cases. I guess I'm just a hick as well as being crazy dog folk.

Brian's Song! Yeah yeah it was made for tv. But James Caan is one of my favorite underrated actors. And Billy Dee Williams is awesome too. "I love Brian Piccolo!" What a great fuckin scene!

Personal Best Yet another groundbreaking, and largely forgotten, movie. Mariel Hemmingway, yum. WHat the hell ever happened to the Hemmingway sisters anyway??

Hoop Dreams Yes it's a documentary. Do they count? Anyway, more than lives up to the hype.

There have to be more sport movies that this, right? Or are we going to be delving into The Greg Louganis Story territory? (BTW, Signs also qualifies as a Non-Sports Movie w/ Athlete Protagonist - he saves the day, too! SWING AWAY!) (AND Naked Gun is the exception - sorta - that proves Ally's Movie + Real Athlete = Crapola on Melba Toast theory, w/ the Juice playing a key role, albeit not a starring one. And then there are the OTHER bazillion football-player-cum-thespians that aren't Jim Brown.)

And for all you yachting fans...

(Why I Love ILX, Reason #521 - it makes me look up words in the dictionary!)

More search: 61*.

I haven't seen either Rudy or Brian's Song (although I know about them through cultural osmosis, of course). I probably lose Guy Points for that.

Also When Saturday Comes.

When the Game Stands Tall: dumbest sports movie title ever?

I hate football more than Democrats, Republicans, Tarantino and Apatow combined.

if you ever see Semi-Tough, be forewarned that in the first 5 minutes Brian Dennehy shakes his bare ass on the screen.

No one mentioned "North Dallas Forty". An amazing film, even those that hate NFL should watch it.

I'm sure I've mentioned it somewhere on here. It's one of my favourite films ever.

http://www.facebook.com/notes/if-they-move-kill-em-steven-jeff-phil-count-down-their-favorite-films/39-north-dallas-forty-ted-kotcheff-1979/212660678761792

North Dallas Forty is so great

I always watch Hoosiers when it's on tv, it's become a sickness.

League of Their Own - also in Hoosiers must watch whenever its on tv category
Miracle
Slapshot
Bad News Bears
The Replacements
The Club (aussie rules footy movie with Jack Thompson k-lassik)

Still hasn't been a really great soccer movie yet. "The Damned Utd" came close I guess.

Yes to North Dallas Forty! I've almost no interest in football, but love that movie. (Mac Davis is great: scene with Nolte in the therapy-jacuzzi, in the sauna, all the scenes with them together.) Also really like Semi-Tough. And Slap Shot, yes.

One (maybe minor but imo significant) ingredient in all of these is that the women in them are interesting and idiosyncratic character characters, too. Let's hear it for the 70s.

(In NDF thinking more of the fuck friend than the girlfriend.)

love the cynicism of NDF

Damned United was p good

kinda liked Goal! but it's too cheesy to really rep for seriously

Not really my genre, but the original Bad News Bears is definitely my fave. And while I would hardly claim it as great, I will usually stop and watch at least a bit of TIn Cup whenever I come across it on commercial TV (which, somewhat surprisingly, it seems to be on nearly as frequently as Die Hard).

Hoosiers is an interesting film to me in that I feel like if it were to get made today, it would be one of those Christian niche movies like Heaven is For Real or whatever. There's a definite strain of Christianity running through it, but the virtues it preaches are ones of forgiveness and charity. There's nothing combative or sanctimonious about its particular spiritual worldview. I can't say I like the film all that much, but it goodhearted.

*it is

I like hoosiers approach to christianity bc it is much more matter-of-fact than many of today's faithbased beat-you-over-the-head nonsense

also it would be hard to tell that story without it, imo

They announced something for TIFF today that sounds great (I won't see it there, but I'm sure other screenings will follow soon after): The Carter Effect, about Vince Carter's long-lasting imprint on Toronto.

The Replacements is still so so bad

Cripes! This thread barely scratches the surface of sports movies. There are movies (and documentaries) about:

• American football (including high school, college, and pro)
• auto racing of every kind including: Gran Prix, Indie cars, stock cars, and drag racing.
• baseball (from Little League up to MLB)
• bicycle racing
• boxing (dozens upon dozens of these!)
• basketball
• bobsled racing
• cross-country foot racing
• dodge ball
• golf
• hockey
• horse racing
• roller derby
• swimming
• track & field events (of many kinds)
• a wide assortment of purely fictitious sports, like Murderball or Death Race 2000
• half a dozen other sports I can't think of this very instant
• plus borderline sports like competitive ballroom dancing or flagpole sitting

hey instead of teling us about ~sports that exist~ maybe tell us about movies *about* these sports that you like... yknow, like the thread suggests

I enjoyed Shaolin Soccer more than I enjoyed Raging Bull, which is odd, but true. I liked Prefontaine more than I enjoyed Rocky III. I liked Breaking Away better than Hoosiers. I liked Two Lane Blacktop better than Slap Shot. I could go on, but that is a start.

Is One on One worth watching? I just stopped on it for a couple of minutes (TCM), and right away I noticed a) G.D. Spradlin and Annette O'Toole, both of whom I've liked/loved in other films, and b) it had that instantly recognizable look from the '70s.

What I've seen/remember of it is all pretty banal. There's a scene where Benson gets a blow job from a drunk older woman that feels like standard teen wish-fulfillment stuff until you realize that Benson co-wrote the screenplay with his father.

I remembered why I disliked Borg vs McEnroe--inexplicably morose--but couldn't remember exactly how much I disliked it, so I opened up the old thread: 5/10. As disappointed as I was by that, I was about equally surprised in the other direction by Battle of the Sexes, the King-Riggs film. (I'm really not that big a tennis fan.) I expected the worst, but a) thought it had a pretty good feel for its era (Borg vs McEnroe had zero) and two or three nice musical cues ("Crimson and Clover" the best); b) liked that it didn't make anyone look cartoonishly stupid (except Howard Cosell, who couldn't overcome actual footage--I have some nostalgia for Cosell, but he's embarrassing here); and c) thought it handled King's tentative acknowledgement of her sexuality well. Did a little follow-up reading on the match (which I'm pretty sure I did watch at the time), and didn't know about the ESPN theory that Riggs threw it to pay off gambling debts. Based on his recent win over Margaret Court I suppose that's possible, but thinking about King's emerging dominance and the age difference, I find it much easier to believe she was simply a lot better.

I have some nostalgia for Cosell, but he's embarrassing here

Cosell was usually embarrassing.

He had his good points, for example, his sympathy for the grossly racist treatment of Ali was genuine, but once he'd gained a toehold in the national sports media he deliberately created a self-clowning persona that he only rarely set aside to be serious. I also blame him more than anyone else for ruining coverage of the Olympics by turning naturally dramatic sporting events into miniature soap operas.

That's primarily what I meant, his support for Ali; also that he was (from what I've read more than from what I actually remember) a self-styled outsider rather than a more typical, at the time, mouthpiece for sports ownership. The way he talks about King in the clips here, though, is all too typical.

Saw a good one the other day, The Bingo Long Traveling All-Stars & Motor Kings (1976), a baseball film set in 1939 in the world of the Negro Leagues. Concerns the travails of a barnstorming baseball team who have a bit of Harlem Globetrotters style to their presentation. Starring Billy Dee Williams and James Earl Jones. Richard Pryor is also in it, v funny as a black player trying to pass as Cuban in hopes of getting accepted into the segregated Major Leagues. Lotsa energy and color in the film. The art department really went to town replicating commercial products and signage of that era, though it's odd to realize that 1939 was closer in time to 1976 than 1976 is to today.

The Athletic's Top 100 (may be behind a paywall).

http://theathletic.com/1703442/2020/03/30/the-athletics-top-100-sports-movies/

On right now, "Bloomfield". Richard Harris as an ageing Israeli footballer(!) (brilliant but troubled), Romy Schneider as his artist girlfriend (long suffering). Directed (barely) by Harris.

Nice soundtrack!

Bloomfield is the name of Hapoel Tel Aviv's stadium by the way.

is Harris a convincing footballer? He was never exactly a commanding physical presence but I can see him as a skinny winger

Not much actual football in it, there was a sequence of him playing at a training session, dribbling past lots of defenders, hitting the bar and heading in the rebound. He does look a bit like a footballer.

that McEnroe film from ... last year? ... is on Criterion Channel

There ought to be a Bill Russell thread...Thought Netflix's Bill Russell: Legend wasn't as good as the Michael Jordan docuseries, but definitely worth watching. Some of the interview footage goes back a ways, so you get everyone from Red Auerbach to present-day players. I think Shaq was my favourite: very thoughtful when it comes to the history of the game. There's an interview clip with Kareem that was puzzling, because he's surrounded by books that are all arranged in small groups of duplicates...which led me to learn he's written 48 (!) books. The Russell/Chamberlain rivalry is one of the film's main storylines: didn't know that they had an extended silence because of something Russell said in an interview (about Chamberlain pulling himself from the final game of the '69 final--doubt he was a big fan of "load management"). Russell's decade after retirement seemed sad in general (with a rebound, so to speak, after that).

Eight consecutive titles, ten out of eleven, eleven out of thirteen--it's hard to get your head around that, for either a player or a team. The Yankees and Canadiens aren't even close.

Nolan ryan doc was also poor

Hard To Beat...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AEfe0LARhgs

did he ever put out one of those instructional videos for kids where he shows you how to cold cock a guy as he charges the mound

Nolan ryan doc was also poor

I didn't care for the Ryan documentary either--maybe too worshipful or something. I did like the Russell film, though--the "also" in your post might be read that I didn't.

The Battered Bastards of Baseball on Netflix was pretty good IIRC

I guess Ben Affleck and Matt Damon never got to make their movie about the Yankee wife swap.

Not sure if I knew about that--would love to see that film.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Ysr3RIHl10

No full episodes on Youtube unfortunately

clemenza, do you have a special thread for sports scenes in otherwise non-sports movies? or should i just post about it here

well anyway i saw THE FRIENDS OF EDDIE COYLE (1973) last night w/ robert mitchum and peter boyle and there's excellent footage of bobby orr and the boston bruins playing the chicago blackhawks. rest of the movie was great too

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CqmyekdW2tk