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why is noon 12pm rather than 12am? Think about it, time goes...

1am 2am 3am...9am 10am 11am 12PM(omgwtf) 1PM 2PM 3PM..10PM 11PM 12AM(wtfwtfwtf)

surely logically you'd go from 1->12am, then start 1PM ->12PM. 0PM would be midday, except that'd sound like that crappy band.

especially since PM = post meridiem = after midday... 12 hours after midday would be midnight??? (but then of course by that argument, AM should run backwards)

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discuss on this thread other things that don't really make sense.

― ken c (ken c), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:15 (twenty-one years ago)

12:01 is after midday, so is definitely post meridiem. Going from saying midday itself is 12 a.m. to 12:01 p.m. would be silly.

― Liz :x (Liz :x), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:16 (twenty-one years ago)

Keith Chegwin.

― Penelope_111 (Penelope_111), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:17 (twenty-one years ago)

Time really goes
12 AM 1am 2am 3am...9am 10am 11am 12PM 1PM 2PM 3PM..10PM 11PM

It's kind of an "aces high" vs. "aces low" question.

(sorry to be so sensical)

Now I'll try to think of something that doesn't make sense.

― Maria D. (Maria D.), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:17 (twenty-one years ago)

It's 12 noon and 12 midnight. My head hurts if I try to call them PM and AM.

― Archel (Archel), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:17 (twenty-one years ago)

i am thinking about this even more now. i guess the bit that REALLY doesn't make sense is why the day starts on 12?? was this before the concept of zero? in that case why didn't the day start at 1???

― ken c (ken c), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:20 (twenty-one years ago)

archel otm though.

― ken c (ken c), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:21 (twenty-one years ago)

Going from saying midday itself is 12 a.m. to 12:01 p.m. would be silly.

Technically, 12:00 should neither be am or pm - since it is neither before nor after the meridien - it's on the meridien.

― o. nate (onate), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:22 (twenty-one years ago)

A better question is why do we use '12' when we could more easily use '0'?

― Andrew (enneff), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:23 (twenty-one years ago)

I translate Dutch for a living. Sometimes I come across "0.00 uur" (0 o'clock) and I get confused. I mean, is it the same as "24.00 uur"?

xpost OTM = on the meridien

― Maria D. (Maria D.), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:24 (twenty-one years ago)

It should be 12 OTM

― Maria D. (Maria D.), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:24 (twenty-one years ago)

! hahaha

― ken c (ken c), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:24 (twenty-one years ago)

maria definitely OTM.

― ken c (ken c), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:25 (twenty-one years ago)

24.00 ?! that doesn't exist

― Andrew (enneff), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:25 (twenty-one years ago)

Inspired, Maria. 12 over the moon. Easy to remember.

― Penelope_111 (Penelope_111), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:25 (twenty-one years ago)

Technically, 12:00 should neither be am or pm - since it is neither before nor after the meridien - it's on the meridien

yes technically they should both be M, but then no-one would know which meridien you were talking about.

Let's all use the 24 hour clock and be done with it!

― MarkH (MarkH), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:26 (twenty-one years ago)

Midday should be 12 PM. The AM hours start at 0000 and finish at 1159.9 recurring. PM starts at 1200. Seems very clear to me.

xpost - the concept of zero was a relatively late mathematical discovery; the concept of time originated much earlier.

― Markelby (Mark C), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:27 (twenty-one years ago)

24.00 is sometimes used in Dutch

― Maria D. (Maria D.), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:28 (twenty-one years ago)

xpost - the concept of zero was a relatively late mathematical discovery; the concept of time originated much earlier.

but that doesn't explain why someone decided that time should start at 12?

― ken c (ken c), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:30 (twenty-one years ago)

I think it went:

1) Midday and midnight are important

2) Clock designers put the 12 at the top coz it's important

3) The thing at the top is a logical place to make something new start, so PM started at 12.

― MarkH (MarkH), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:32 (twenty-one years ago)

Speaking of zero, have any of you heard the Cat Stevens album about numbers? "Jzero" comes along and messes up everybody's shit. This was one of my fave albums as a child. We even named our dog Jzero.

― Maria D. (Maria D.), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:34 (twenty-one years ago)

And then there's Zero the dog in A Nightmare Before Christmas

― Markelby (Mark C), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:37 (twenty-one years ago)

and Sub-Zero on Mortal Kombat, who is the coolest! (in every sense!)

― ken c (ken c), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:38 (twenty-one years ago)

Oh, I didn't kill the thread after all! Cat Stevens could be a sure-fire thread-killa

― Maria D. (Maria D.), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:38 (twenty-one years ago)

elsewhere in the universe, cat stevens must be a thread-startah, if you believe in the zero sum theory

― ken c (ken c), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:39 (twenty-one years ago)

haha

So, how come we don't call this decade "the noughties"?

― Maria D. (Maria D.), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:39 (twenty-one years ago)

well, i guess the sixties and seventies were named after 60 and 70, as if it's short for the "sixty something years".. etc.

so actually if that follows then maybe this decade should just be the "noughts" or the "zeroes"! Next decade would just be weird! ("the -teens"?)

― ken c (ken c), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:48 (twenty-one years ago)

but if it's to rhyme, it'd be the TEENIES!!!!! omg i'm copyrighting that right now!

― ken c (ken c), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:48 (twenty-one years ago)

2020 should be called Tweenie!

― MarkH (MarkH), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:49 (twenty-one years ago)

Somebody give me a good reason why we don't all just use the 24-hour clock instead of splitting the day into two, I mean honestly everything is digital now, the 12-hour radial clock face is fucking obsolete, ok?

― TOMBOT, Friday, 27 August 2004 13:49 (twenty-one years ago)

Because when somebody says "14 o'clock" you have to subtract 12 in your head to figure out they mean 2 in the afternoon.

― Maria D. (Maria D.), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:50 (twenty-one years ago)

but instead you'd say "fourteen hundred hours, sir!"

― Ste (Fuzzy), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:53 (twenty-one years ago)

And click your heels and salute

― Maria D. (Maria D.), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:54 (twenty-one years ago)

the radial clock helps future generation soldiers not to get confused when given information like "sniper at 2 o'clock" or something.

― ken c (ken c), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:57 (twenty-one years ago)

12:00 is either midnight or noon, never 12 p.m., 12 a.m., 12 noon, nor 12 midnight. This is according to CP/AP styleguide.

― Huck, Friday, 27 August 2004 13:58 (twenty-one years ago)

"we can relax we've got ages yet!"

"Can you really see into the future, sir?"

― MarkH (MarkH), Friday, 27 August 2004 13:59 (twenty-one years ago)

12:00 is either midnight or noon, never 12 p.m., 12 a.m., 12 noon, nor 12 midnight. This is according to CP/AP styleguide.

But 12:01 is AM or PM

Time doesn't start with 0 because then the last hour would be 11, which is a stupid number to end on, because there are 12 hours in a half day.

― dave225 (Dave225), Friday, 27 August 2004 14:04 (twenty-one years ago)

but the last hour is STILL 11!!!

― ken c (ken c), Friday, 27 August 2004 14:08 (twenty-one years ago)

Potato, potato.

We should rename the hours as animals instead of numbers.

― dave225 (Dave225), Friday, 27 August 2004 14:11 (twenty-one years ago)

It's elephant already. I better get to work!

― Maria D. (Maria D.), Friday, 27 August 2004 14:12 (twenty-one years ago)

why not just have them called the same thing as the signs of the Zodiac.

― MarkH (MarkH), Friday, 27 August 2004 14:12 (twenty-one years ago)

So are minutes still numbers, or should we use food names?

e.g. "I'll meet you at Zebra Beets"

― dave225 (Dave225), Friday, 27 August 2004 14:14 (twenty-one years ago)

avocadOHTHIRTY

― Maria D. (Maria D.), Friday, 27 August 2004 14:16 (twenty-one years ago)

My wall clock at home consists of 17 letters instead of numbers and the seconds hand only moves one second on and then it goes backwards.

― Ste (Fuzzy), Friday, 27 August 2004 14:18 (twenty-one years ago)

Hey, there's a coloquialism in the South I heard recently for early in the morning: "Chicken Thirty" Them Southerners are way ahead of us.

― dave225 (Dave225), Friday, 27 August 2004 14:19 (twenty-one years ago)

When it's Tooth hurty, it's time to go to a dentist

― Maria D. (Maria D.), Friday, 27 August 2004 14:20 (twenty-one years ago)

the minutes should be a language name.

"Hey Maria D, would you come to FAP at dog:latin later?? Dog Latin will be there too!"

― ken c (ken c), Friday, 27 August 2004 14:20 (twenty-one years ago)

I'm busy until pig:latin

― Maria D. (Maria D.), Friday, 27 August 2004 14:21 (twenty-one years ago)

well we'll be at the pub until the dial is on crocodile so come later if you can!

― ken c (ken c), Friday, 27 August 2004 14:23 (twenty-one years ago)

omg there should be a clock with actual hand shaped minute hands and little biting crocodiles as the numebers!!

― ken c (ken c), Friday, 27 August 2004 14:24 (twenty-one years ago)

That particular one wouldn't work.. You couldn't say "after awhile, crocodile" without confusing people.

― dave225 (Dave225), Friday, 27 August 2004 14:25 (twenty-one years ago)

Ditto alligators

― Penelope_111 (Penelope_111), Friday, 27 August 2004 14:26 (twenty-one years ago)

I vote for llamas on the clock

― Maria D. (Maria D.), Friday, 27 August 2004 14:31 (twenty-one years ago)

At the crack of ass could take on real meaning

― Maria D. (Maria D.), Friday, 27 August 2004 14:31 (twenty-one years ago)

haha! i havne't been awake at the crack of ass in donkey's years!

― ken c (ken c), Friday, 27 August 2004 14:37 (twenty-one years ago)

12 o'clock starts the midday for the same reason that the 2000 century is the 21st century and didn't start until 0:00 01/01/01.

― Pleasant Plains (Pleasant Plains), Friday, 27 August 2004 15:47 (twenty-one years ago)

But .. but .. nevermind.

― dave225 (Dave225), Friday, 27 August 2004 15:58 (twenty-one years ago)

The way a clock dial should really be is 0 - 1 - 2 - 3, with 0 on top. However, you try teaching a six-year old that there's twelve hours in half a day even though the clock only goes up to 11.

(Which, come to think of it now dave, is completely contradictory to what I just said. I'll do the neverminding here.)

― Pleasant Plains (Pleasant Plains), Friday, 27 August 2004 16:10 (twenty-one years ago)

It should be:
Midnight, 0:01, 0:02, ..
1:00
2:00
3:00 ..
Noon, 0:01, 0:02, ...
1:00
2:00
3:00 ..

― dave225 (Dave225), Friday, 27 August 2004 16:18 (twenty-one years ago)

In ancient cultures the new day was considered to start at sunset, which is kind of odd.

― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Friday, 27 August 2004 16:24 (twenty-one years ago)

...stupid ancient fucks.

― dave225 (Dave225), Friday, 27 August 2004 16:26 (twenty-one years ago)

If you really think about it, the new day should start around 4 am, much in the same way that the international date line is in the middle of the ocean.

When the clock people change the Daylight and Standard Time around at two, it makes the bar either close an hour early or pisses off everyone since the bar won't stay open an hour later.

― Pleasant Plains (Pleasant Plains), Friday, 27 August 2004 17:09 (twenty-one years ago)

I'm not sure it did Kevin, I think the day started at sunrise, which is quite a logical place for it to start.

― MarkH (MarkH), Saturday, 28 August 2004 10:34 (twenty-one years ago)

here in Ethiopia time is measured as follows
7 AM = 1
12 PM = 6
6 PM = 12

7 AM = 1

Logic is that 7 is the first hour of the day, 8 is the second hour and so on, 7 PM is the first hour of the night and takes you back to 6 AM which is 12.

i have no idea if that made any sense or not.

― H (Heruy), Saturday, 28 August 2004 12:17 (twenty-one years ago)

Whoa! Do your clocks look different?

― Maria D. (Maria D.), Saturday, 28 August 2004 12:21 (twenty-one years ago)

that's awesome, i could waste a whole day and it would still only be noon?

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Saturday, 28 August 2004 13:00 (twenty-one years ago)

my microwave is german, and when it gets to 23:59 it just keep going to 24:01 on up to 1:00. it makes sense (although i agree that 0:00 would make even more sense)

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Saturday, 28 August 2004 13:25 (twenty-one years ago)

Markh - yeah that would make more sense - however, I was aware of what I was saying. Thinking about it, my evidence for this is scant, but I did just find where I read it - a dictionary of folklore - and it discusses the ambiguous nature of midnight, and perhaps that's why it was considered supernatural. When discussing New Year's etc. it says "This is because by modern reckoining a day begins at midnight (not at sunset, as in ancient cultures)". I'll need to investigate further, I guess.

― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Saturday, 28 August 2004 15:04 (twenty-one years ago)

As for those crazy Germans, what's with 'Half to' instead of 'half past'?

― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Saturday, 28 August 2004 15:05 (twenty-one years ago)

Their hour is half empty, our hour half full.

― Maria D. (Maria D.), Saturday, 28 August 2004 15:20 (twenty-one years ago)

They are looking to the future, we are looking to the past.

― Alba (Alba), Saturday, 28 August 2004 15:25 (twenty-one years ago)

Hence we talk about the war.

― MarkH (MarkH), Saturday, 28 August 2004 15:26 (twenty-one years ago)

my microwave is german...

How many does it seat?

― Pleasant Plains (Pleasant Plains), Saturday, 28 August 2004 15:27 (twenty-one years ago)

Time is annoying. Can't we just ignore it and hope it'll get bored and go away?

― Kim (Kim), Saturday, 28 August 2004 17:58 (twenty-one years ago)

what the hell do you need to microwave for 24 hours anyway?

― jed_ (jed), Saturday, 28 August 2004 18:12 (twenty-one years ago)

to respond to Maria

usually people just use the standard clocks while following ethiop time, but there are a few that use ethiop mumbers (completely different) I will look for a pic and post it for you.

― H (Heruy), Sunday, 29 August 2004 12:20 (twenty-one years ago)

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