Religious conservatives and family-values groups are planning to wage a battle against Fox Searchlight's Kinsey, about the pioneering sex researcher, when the movie opens in limited release on Friday. In a statement on Wednesday, Robert Knight of Concerned Women for America charged that the movie "lionized" a man whose "proper place is with Nazi Dr. Josef Mengele or your average Hollywood horror flick mad scientist." Knight went on to assert that Kinsey "was the godfather of the homosexual activist movement, the campaign to mainstream pornography, and even the campaign to strike down abortion laws." The youth group Generation Life, composed of "virgins and renewed virgins," announced that it would picket theaters showing the film. And the conservative WorldNetDaily.com has taken aim at the movie in the current issue of its monthly magazine Whistleblower, in which it charges that Kinsey transformed America "in five decades from the Leave It to Beaver innocence of the 1950s to today's wanton, 'anything-goes' sexual anarchy."
― s1ocki (slutsky), Friday, 12 November 2004 05:54 (twenty-one years ago)
― hstencil (hstencil), Friday, 12 November 2004 05:56 (twenty-one years ago)
― s1ocki (slutsky), Friday, 12 November 2004 05:57 (twenty-one years ago)
Did these people actually ever LIVE in the 1950s?
― jaymc (jaymc), Friday, 12 November 2004 05:57 (twenty-one years ago)
― Allyzay Science Explosion (allyzay), Friday, 12 November 2004 05:57 (twenty-one years ago)
― Hi, I am a genius. a big one. (AaronHz), Friday, 12 November 2004 05:58 (twenty-one years ago)
― Hi, I am a genius. a big one. (AaronHz), Friday, 12 November 2004 05:59 (twenty-one years ago)
― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Friday, 12 November 2004 06:08 (twenty-one years ago)
― Miss Misery (thatgirl), Friday, 12 November 2004 06:09 (twenty-one years ago)
― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Friday, 12 November 2004 06:10 (twenty-one years ago)
― s1ocki (slutsky), Friday, 12 November 2004 06:18 (twenty-one years ago)
aside from its current state of sexual nihilism
― kingfish (Kingfish), Friday, 12 November 2004 06:22 (twenty-one years ago)
― Trayce (trayce), Friday, 12 November 2004 06:26 (twenty-one years ago)
― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Friday, 12 November 2004 06:26 (twenty-one years ago)
― Allyzay Science Explosion (allyzay), Friday, 12 November 2004 06:27 (twenty-one years ago)
― Riot Gear! (Gear!), Friday, 12 November 2004 06:30 (twenty-one years ago)
― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Friday, 12 November 2004 06:30 (twenty-one years ago)
― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Friday, 12 November 2004 06:37 (twenty-one years ago)
― Remy (x Jeremy), Friday, 12 November 2004 06:37 (twenty-one years ago)
― Remy (x Jeremy), Friday, 12 November 2004 06:39 (twenty-one years ago)
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 12 November 2004 06:40 (twenty-one years ago)
"Of my extended family I've had sex with 17 out of 31 members. I've had fornicated with 2,451 individual partners and 16 species of animals. Of these, 231 were preadolescent girls, and 648 were preadolescent boys. Have you ever seen a little boy ejaculate, Mr. Kinsey? It's exactly like a grown man, but nothing comes out."
― Remy (x Jeremy), Friday, 12 November 2004 06:42 (twenty-one years ago)
― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Friday, 12 November 2004 06:43 (twenty-one years ago)
― Alex in NYC (vassifer), Friday, 12 November 2004 06:44 (twenty-one years ago)
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 12 November 2004 06:45 (twenty-one years ago)
― Allyzay Science Explosion (allyzay), Friday, 12 November 2004 06:47 (twenty-one years ago)
― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Friday, 12 November 2004 06:47 (twenty-one years ago)
― Remy (x Jeremy), Friday, 12 November 2004 06:48 (twenty-one years ago)
― s1ocki (slutsky), Friday, 12 November 2004 06:49 (twenty-one years ago)
― Remy (x Jeremy), Friday, 12 November 2004 06:50 (twenty-one years ago)
― s1ocki (slutsky), Friday, 12 November 2004 06:51 (twenty-one years ago)
― gypsy mothra (gypsy mothra), Friday, 12 November 2004 07:04 (twenty-one years ago)
― Remy (x Jeremy), Friday, 12 November 2004 07:06 (twenty-one years ago)
"i finally came!"
― latebloomer (latebloomer), Friday, 12 November 2004 07:52 (twenty-one years ago)
― Hi, I am a genius. a big one. (AaronHz), Friday, 12 November 2004 07:54 (twenty-one years ago)
ROBERT of Concerned WOMEN, though.
wow.
― chicago, now! (chicago, now!), Friday, 12 November 2004 07:54 (twenty-one years ago)
― Hi, I am a genius. a big one. (AaronHz), Friday, 12 November 2004 07:55 (twenty-one years ago)
― latebloomer (latebloomer), Friday, 12 November 2004 07:56 (twenty-one years ago)
― Hi, I am a genius. a big one. (AaronHz), Friday, 12 November 2004 07:57 (twenty-one years ago)
― Hi, I am a genius. a big one. (AaronHz), Friday, 12 November 2004 07:59 (twenty-one years ago)
Um...
???
― caitlin (caitlin), Friday, 12 November 2004 08:14 (twenty-one years ago)
― Remy (x Jeremy), Friday, 12 November 2004 08:15 (twenty-one years ago)
― Hi, I am a genius. a big one. (AaronHz), Friday, 12 November 2004 08:16 (twenty-one years ago)
― Remy (x Jeremy), Friday, 12 November 2004 08:16 (twenty-one years ago)
― H (Heruy), Friday, 12 November 2004 09:02 (twenty-one years ago)
― Hi, I am a genius. a big one. (AaronHz), Friday, 12 November 2004 09:06 (twenty-one years ago)
The business arm of the GOP - the real leaders - lets its idiot fundie wing make noise about this sort of shit so that they can go about the serious business of jacking the tax code while the media is distracted.
― erferfefewrferf, Friday, 12 November 2004 09:32 (twenty-one years ago)
― anthony, Friday, 12 November 2004 15:18 (twenty-one years ago)
― anthony, Friday, 12 November 2004 15:22 (twenty-one years ago)
― Jordan (Jordan), Friday, 12 November 2004 15:24 (twenty-one years ago)
― Onimo (GerryNemo), Friday, 12 November 2004 15:30 (twenty-one years ago)
― anthony, Friday, 12 November 2004 15:36 (twenty-one years ago)
This is an excellent example as to why. Did this virulent conservatism come out of nowhere or was I just not paying attention?
― Laura H. (laurah), Friday, 12 November 2004 15:59 (twenty-one years ago)
― Markelby (Mark C), Friday, 12 November 2004 17:17 (twenty-one years ago)
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 12 November 2004 17:19 (twenty-one years ago)
Robert Knight of Concerned Women for America OR Renewed Virgins?
Help me out!
― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Friday, 12 November 2004 17:20 (twenty-one years ago)
― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Friday, 12 November 2004 17:22 (twenty-one years ago)
― suzy (suzy), Friday, 12 November 2004 17:42 (twenty-one years ago)
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 12 November 2004 17:46 (twenty-one years ago)
― Michael Daddino (epicharmus), Friday, 12 November 2004 17:48 (twenty-one years ago)
― antexit (antexit), Friday, 12 November 2004 22:35 (twenty-one years ago)
― Layna Andersen (Layna Andersen), Friday, 12 November 2004 22:37 (twenty-one years ago)
― LSTD (answer) (sexyDancer), Friday, 12 November 2004 23:17 (twenty-one years ago)
― j.m. lockery (j.m. lockery), Friday, 12 November 2004 23:24 (twenty-one years ago)
― Michael White (Hereward), Friday, 12 November 2004 23:26 (twenty-one years ago)
― Hi, I am a genius. a big one. (AaronHz), Friday, 12 November 2004 23:28 (twenty-one years ago)
― oops (Oops), Friday, 12 November 2004 23:29 (twenty-one years ago)
― Hi, I am a genius. a big one. (AaronHz), Friday, 12 November 2004 23:30 (twenty-one years ago)
― suzy (suzy), Friday, 12 November 2004 23:31 (twenty-one years ago)
― Hi, I am a genius. a big one. (AaronHz), Friday, 12 November 2004 23:33 (twenty-one years ago)
― gypsy mothra (gypsy mothra), Friday, 12 November 2004 23:37 (twenty-one years ago)
Kevin, the book you're thinking of is "We" by zamyatin, I think.
― mouse (mouse), Saturday, 13 November 2004 00:01 (twenty-one years ago)
― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Saturday, 13 November 2004 00:07 (twenty-one years ago)
― mouse (mouse), Saturday, 13 November 2004 00:14 (twenty-one years ago)
― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Saturday, 13 November 2004 00:17 (twenty-one years ago)
― cinniblount (James Blount), Saturday, 13 November 2004 00:18 (twenty-one years ago)
― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Saturday, 13 November 2004 00:19 (twenty-one years ago)
― Kevin Gilchrist (Mr Fusion), Saturday, 13 November 2004 00:32 (twenty-one years ago)
― tokyo rosemary (rosemary), Saturday, 13 November 2004 03:14 (twenty-one years ago)
― anthony, Saturday, 13 November 2004 21:38 (twenty-one years ago)
― H (Heruy), Saturday, 13 November 2004 21:53 (twenty-one years ago)
Haha!
"This movie would be PERFECTLY all right if it just starred Kirk Cameron!"
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 13 November 2004 21:56 (twenty-one years ago)
― Casuistry (Chris P), Saturday, 13 November 2004 22:02 (twenty-one years ago)
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 13 November 2004 22:32 (twenty-one years ago)
― Casuistry (Chris P), Saturday, 13 November 2004 22:39 (twenty-one years ago)
― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Saturday, 13 November 2004 22:40 (twenty-one years ago)
_Kirk Cameron's Asian Knights_
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 13 November 2004 22:41 (twenty-one years ago)
both in Kinsey and all the Left Behind films
― H (Heruy), Saturday, 13 November 2004 22:43 (twenty-one years ago)
― kingfish (Kingfish), Saturday, 13 November 2004 23:10 (twenty-one years ago)
― caitlin (caitlin), Saturday, 13 November 2004 23:13 (twenty-one years ago)
"That's why it's called 'acting,' Kirk."
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 13 November 2004 23:13 (twenty-one years ago)
― Casuistry (Chris P), Saturday, 13 November 2004 23:13 (twenty-one years ago)
he also had Julie McCullogh fired from the show for posing in Playboy.
― kingfish (Kingfish), Saturday, 13 November 2004 23:23 (twenty-one years ago)
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 13 November 2004 23:23 (twenty-one years ago)
― H (Heruy), Saturday, 13 November 2004 23:47 (twenty-one years ago)
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 13 November 2004 23:57 (twenty-one years ago)
― J Sims, Sunday, 14 November 2004 00:43 (twenty-one years ago)
― MC Transmaniacon (natepatrin), Sunday, 14 November 2004 01:13 (twenty-one years ago)
WELCOME TO OUR WORLDby Dan Savage
Liberals Are the New Gays
Liberals are staring into the red belly of this country with incomprehension and fear. They are wondering how one even begins to talk to the huge percentage of voters who told exit pollsters last Tuesday that "moral values" guided them in choosing president Bush. Among straight liberals there is a sudden feeling that it is desperately urgent to reach out to these people, that the straight liberal way of life may depend on it.
Welcome to our world.
We gay Americans have been wondering how to engage these people for years, and not just in an abstract, political-strategizing sort of way. For too many gay Americans, the homophobic wing of the "moral values" voting bloc includes mom and dad, the ones who disowned their child simply for being queer. These kids, and those of us who befriend them in their urban exile, have long known that a vast swath of red America would like nothing better than to push us first out of their territory, and then from our coastal enclaves straight into the sea. So the wounded contempt generated by the new map of divided America isn't new to us.
And here is what we have learned about the religious fundamentalists who hide their ignorance and fear behind a cloak of "moral values," and who, through the cynical attentions of the Republican Party, have now become political kingmakers: First, you cannot compromise with them. As the Republicans themselves frequently remind us in another context, to compromise with a religious fundamentalist is to establish a moral equivalence between his or her core convictions and your own; it is, in other words, to cede far too much ground. You do not change a homophobe by suggesting that he is correct, just as you do not change an Islamic fundamentalist by allowing that perhaps nonbelievers should be killed. There will be a temptation among Democrats to do this, however, to pander to America's evangelical fundamentalist voters by aping Bush's strategy of pretending to be one of them. Don't do it. It is inimical to the core values of liberalism, it is a step toward quasi-theocracy, and it would only embolden the bigots, the anti-choice control freaks, and the God-appointed totalitarians.
It is also a waste of time, which bring us to the second lesson gay people have learned in dealing with America's homophobic "moral values" voters: A certain percentage of these religious fundamentalists simply cannot be swayed from their beliefs. There is no debate with them, no appeal to rationality or even common humanity. God has told them what's right, and they're not changing. The gay children of people like this generally have to cut off or greatly circumscribe contact with their parents in order to maintain their own dignity. It is a painful process, but ultimately it creates the reward fundamentalists deserve: estrangement from the open-minded world and a lonely death. The Democrats should do likewise: give up on the fundamentalists who simply won't change, and let them die estranged from our culture.
The fear, looking at the electoral map, is that we simply can't do this now because there seems to be more of them than us, meaning they're not dying off fast enough, or if they are, they're being rapidly replaced by new true believers. Don't buy this, it's too simple. As gay children of religious parents know, there are a good number of nominal religious fundamentalists who are, in fact, open to new ideas. Some voters, like some parents, can change. If you stand up to them, and persistently but politely call them on their pseudo-moral bullshit, these people will eventually come around--if not to acceptance, then to grudging respect, or at least a respectful détente. Great is the number of families with gay children (think of the Cheneys) who discover an elasticity in their supposedly unchanging "values" when someone they know challenges them in the right way.
* * *
Paradoxically, just as straight liberals are finding themselves to be on the same cultural island as gay Americans, a good number of gay Americans appear to be under the delusion that they are welcome in the sea of red. How else to explain the fact that exit polls showed 23 percent of gay American voters chose Bush, down only 2 percent from 2000?
While straight liberals need to figure out how to deal with the evangelical fundamentalist problem better, gay liberals need to figure out how to better deal with this problem: In an election where Republicans deliberately used homophobia to rally their base, the lesson the gay community taught them was, "Go right ahead, we'll vote for you anyway." It appears the Republicans are on their way to doing with some gay Americans what they have so successfully done with the poor and the uneducated. They are turning a good number of us into a reliable constituency that can be counted on to vote against its own interests.
If for no other reason than our own self-interest, liberal gays need to find these conservative gays and beat some sense into them. The pressure on the Democratic Party to move more into the "mainstream" (i.e., away from gay rights) is already huge. If we can't reward with our votes the Democrats who stick their necks out to support us, then we gay Americans are being willing accomplices in our own destruction.
― Riot Gear! (Gear!), Sunday, 14 November 2004 01:40 (twenty-one years ago)
1) The homosexual relationship between AK and CM is unconvincing, poorly-managed, and as far as this film's dynamic is concerned, extraneous.
2) I'm not sold on any part of the AK / CK relationship. It exists on an intellectual level, yes, but there doesn't seem to be much of an emotional connection between the couple. This may factually be true, but it's unfortunate Linney and Neeson took this as predominant script-note. There's little drama in watching the romantic leads of a picture miscommunicate for all of their time together.
3) The ending scene in the forest is weird and pointless. Ditto the insert of Kinsey seeing himself as a boy scout at the end of the movie. In the scripts I read Kinsey dies; this provides the dramatic closure (closure in the true literary sense, not the overused emotional one) which the film needs.
4) I love: Platt, Redgrave, Lithgow, Curry.
5) What the f* was happening with the water glasses? How many times can one see a water-glass lifted into the air? I'm guessing they're meant to be symbolic, but of what? "Yuk, yuk, 'bottoms-up!" Pseudo-arty nonsense!
― Remy (x Jeremy), Sunday, 14 November 2004 01:52 (twenty-one years ago)
― kingfish (Kingfish), Sunday, 14 November 2004 02:19 (twenty-one years ago)
― Girolamo Savonarola, Monday, 3 January 2005 07:48 (twenty-one years ago)
― Hurting (Hurting), Monday, 3 January 2005 08:06 (twenty-one years ago)
Kinsey is one of those movies that really, REALLY fucking inspires me re: "Science is so important! Scientists are so heroic!" But remy's points are unfortunately right on, tho I have to say Skaarsgard is one attractive naked man.
― Abbott, Tuesday, 22 January 2008 00:49 (eighteen years ago)