God save der fuhrer

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http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4170083.stm

― Masked Gazza, Thursday, 13 January 2005 00:05 (twenty-one years ago)

The Board of Deputies of British Jews said the costume was in "bad taste".

Oh the Board of Deputies of British Jews says a lot of things.

― Stevem On X (blueski), Thursday, 13 January 2005 00:47 (twenty-one years ago)

i'm disappointed he didn't make more effort with the rest of the costume. slacker.

― Stevem On X (blueski), Thursday, 13 January 2005 00:50 (twenty-one years ago)

What with Paolo, it's been quite a week for fascism!

Do you think it's 'in' now? January is the time to look for new trends

― Masked Gazza, Thursday, 13 January 2005 00:53 (twenty-one years ago)

maybe the trains will finally start running on time

― Stevem On X (blueski), Thursday, 13 January 2005 01:02 (twenty-one years ago)

The closing line makes it though.

The Sun reported that Prince William was also at the party - dressed as a lion.

― martin m. (mushrush), Thursday, 13 January 2005 01:03 (twenty-one years ago)

i'm disappointed he didn't make more effort with the rest of the costume. slacker.

Yeah, you'd think as prince, he could just waltz into the Imperial War Museum and take whatever he wants!

― Spencer Chow (spencermfi), Thursday, 13 January 2005 01:06 (twenty-one years ago)

Still, why would he pick this costume at all???

― Spencer Chow (spencermfi), Thursday, 13 January 2005 01:07 (twenty-one years ago)

I'd like to see the rest of the costumes from this 'colonial and native' themed party myself.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 13 January 2005 01:08 (twenty-one years ago)

I wonder if anyone went dressed as Bhabha or Said.

― Spencer Chow (spencermfi), Thursday, 13 January 2005 01:13 (twenty-one years ago)

So what's the expiration date for the British Royal Family? Surely it will be abolished within a couple of generations, right?

― milozauckerman (miloaukerman), Thursday, 13 January 2005 01:14 (twenty-one years ago)

If they keep reminding us how stupid they are it might happen by the time of the Mayan apocalypse

"Still, why would he pick this costume at all???"

Maybe he sees great uncle Eddie as a role model

― Masked Gazza, Thursday, 13 January 2005 01:18 (twenty-one years ago)

Prince Harry should have come as Vyvyan, then none of this would have been as "ew"... Harry would have been a hero instead...(well, maybe)

― donut christ (donut), Thursday, 13 January 2005 01:19 (twenty-one years ago)

I thought Harry was the smart one?

― Mr Noodles (Mr Noodles), Thursday, 13 January 2005 01:22 (twenty-one years ago)

Terror. That's like saying "I thought Jeb was the looker"

― Masked Gazza, Thursday, 13 January 2005 01:24 (twenty-one years ago)

Sorry, I thought he was the older one. He's the one that's got Fergie's hair and brain.

― Mr Noodles (Mr Noodles), Thursday, 13 January 2005 01:28 (twenty-one years ago)

"Maybe he sees great uncle Eddie as a role model"

I was thinking the very same thing.

― earlnash, Thursday, 13 January 2005 01:30 (twenty-one years ago)

The most regretful thing is that the Queen Mum aint still around,
cos you know she'd have given him a bloody good hiding for this

― **%@, Thursday, 13 January 2005 01:44 (twenty-one years ago)

I can see a way out of this for the royals - just admit that he's not actually a member of their family at all!

― gatinha, Thursday, 13 January 2005 01:44 (twenty-one years ago)

youch!

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 13 January 2005 04:27 (twenty-one years ago)

"Hey! I'VE GOT AN IDEA! I THINK I'LL GO PLAY MURDER IN THE DARK!"

― donut christ (donut), Thursday, 13 January 2005 04:32 (twenty-one years ago)

this is what marijuana can do, kids.

― Miles Finch, Thursday, 13 January 2005 09:25 (twenty-one years ago)

with a great uncle who was a member of the SS and the 60th anniversary of the liberation of auschwitz and all, this isn't just stupid, it's almost INSANELY vulgar, on a par with brian may playing a fuzz guitar 'god save the queen' on the roof of buckingham palace!

― debden, Thursday, 13 January 2005 09:30 (twenty-one years ago)

it's a very james hewitt thing to do, isn't it?

― Marcello Carlin, Thursday, 13 January 2005 09:32 (twenty-one years ago)

oooh! get him!

― debden, Thursday, 13 January 2005 09:34 (twenty-one years ago)

The Sun reported that Prince William was also at the party - dressed as a lion.

The Board of Deputies of British Wildebeest said the costume was "in bad taste".

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Thursday, 13 January 2005 09:39 (twenty-one years ago)

What amazes me is of the massive coterie of people who surround the prince, not one of them thought to say "erm, are you SURE this is a good idea? Do you really want to be on the front page of the Sun dressed as a Nazi?"

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Thursday, 13 January 2005 09:42 (twenty-one years ago)

perhaps he fancies dannii minogue.

― Marcello Carlin, Thursday, 13 January 2005 09:44 (twenty-one years ago)

what sort of people was he mixing with in argentina?

― debden, Thursday, 13 January 2005 09:45 (twenty-one years ago)

a group of aging german expatriates applauded the act, then drove off very fast as mossad agents appeared at the end of the street

― debden, Thursday, 13 January 2005 09:47 (twenty-one years ago)

wots minogue been up to, nazi-wise?

― Miles Finch, Thursday, 13 January 2005 09:50 (twenty-one years ago)

are you SURE this is a good idea

Dude, the coterie that surrounds the prince thought it would be cool and fun to have a 'colonials and natives' party. How many of them do you think blacked up for the occasion? I'm not sure how Nazism fits into the colonial thing anyway, but maybe Harry's just been reading Vice recently.

― Liz :x (Liz :x), Thursday, 13 January 2005 09:55 (twenty-one years ago)

xpost:

The thread in question.

― Marcello Carlin, Thursday, 13 January 2005 09:56 (twenty-one years ago)

Its just a bit of fun...

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Thursday, 13 January 2005 09:58 (twenty-one years ago)

harry should have gone as a worthless treaty or a smallpox infected blanket

― debden, Thursday, 13 January 2005 10:01 (twenty-one years ago)

I'd like to see the rest of the costumes from this 'colonial and native' themed party myself.
-- Ned Raggett (ne...), January 13th, 2005

Anyone who goes to parties like that AND Chinawhites really is the worst kind of horrible upper class english wanker. Get rid of the lots of them!

― Robin Goad (rgoad), Thursday, 13 January 2005 10:07 (twenty-one years ago)

YES EVERY CATASTROPHE WAR SLAUGHTER AND GENOCIDE IS JUST A BIT OF FUN INNIT?

― Marcello Carlin, Thursday, 13 January 2005 10:11 (twenty-one years ago)

what do old punks think of this?

― Miles Finch, Thursday, 13 January 2005 10:14 (twenty-one years ago)

siouxsie in uncut last month was unrepentant about her swastikas. of "love in a void" she now says by 'too many jews for my liking' she meant 'too many skinflints for my liking' and therefore it wasn't meant to be anti-semitic (!!!!!!?????!?!?!?!!!).

― Marcello Carlin, Thursday, 13 January 2005 10:18 (twenty-one years ago)

Ha, I read that as well. Another case of "oh dear this person isn't nearly as smart as I thought they were".

Haha the fucking royals. Shoot them.

― Pashmina (Pashmina), Thursday, 13 January 2005 10:21 (twenty-one years ago)

(Sorry, "just a bit of fun" is an injokey meme. Its the caveat usually used by racists to avoid being branded racist)

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Thursday, 13 January 2005 10:21 (twenty-one years ago)

Sometimes it is used by people who are not racists though.

― Dave B (daveb), Thursday, 13 January 2005 10:32 (twenty-one years ago)

My friend dressed up as a nazi for his 21st birthday. Full uniform, I'm amazed the fancy dress shop actually gives out those costumes.

― Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 13 January 2005 10:33 (twenty-one years ago)

sounds just like a scene from Father Ted...

― Stevem On X (blueski), Thursday, 13 January 2005 10:35 (twenty-one years ago)

i am hoping that Siouxsie just has a really, really warped sense of humour

― Stevem On X (blueski), Thursday, 13 January 2005 10:36 (twenty-one years ago)

Did he go commando?

― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Thursday, 13 January 2005 10:40 (twenty-one years ago)

I am looking forward to many more years of entertainment from Prince Harry.

They used to sell nazi uniforms in toy shops - honest. I wasn't allowed one, so I had a cowboy suit instead.

― Puddin'Head Miller (PJ Miller), Thursday, 13 January 2005 10:40 (twenty-one years ago)

'Haha the fucking royals. Shoot them'

That might be a bit extreme, I was just thinking of stripping them of their titles...

― Robin Goad (rgoad), Thursday, 13 January 2005 11:05 (twenty-one years ago)

Damn fundamentalists, they all need shooting.

― Jarlr'mai (jarlrmai), Thursday, 13 January 2005 11:13 (twenty-one years ago)

i'd like to see Prince Harry a Bukkake themed party. In that costume.

― Hari A$hur$t (Toaster), Thursday, 13 January 2005 11:53 (twenty-one years ago)

Skipping 276 messages at this point... Click here if you want to load them all.

this thread should only be revived if harry appears at a fancy dress party next year as a 1970s argentinian helicopter dropping little figurines of socialist dissidents from high in the air into a fibreglass simulacrum of the atlantic ocean.

― debden, Friday, 14 January 2005 16:46 (twenty-one years ago)

i'm sorry guys.. by morons i actually only meant one person. and the pointless argument was the specifically the last post by ronan about "why bother ... etc". i mean wtf ronan.

― ken c (ken c), Friday, 14 January 2005 16:56 (twenty-one years ago)

just in case anyone else misunderstands.

― ken c (ken c), Friday, 14 January 2005 16:58 (twenty-one years ago)

At what point, if ever, will the insignia and paraphanalia of Nazism lose their power? If this had been a fancy dress party with a medieval theme and Harry had gone as Edward I, would there have been as much dismay? (I'm not trying to compare Edward I to a nazi nor the 13th century English to the Nazis, nor trying to diminish the unique evil of the Shoah.) What about Caesar or Napoleon? What troubles me most about the persistence of Nazi imagery's power is the way the ideology still feeds off it. That's genuinely one of the things I like about 'The Producers': it reduces rather than nourishes the iconic power of Nazi imagery.

Very obliquely: My gf's stepmother's mother was taken from the Lodz ghetto and sent to Auschwitz. Last summer she went back for the first time since '49 and I was struck by how much calmer about it she was than her kids. She still speaks Polish (better than Yiddish appparently) to other survivors she knows in New York so there wasn't a linguistic barrier and I can understand that for all the horror of the ghetto and the camp, she had fond memories of her childhood that have perhaps grown in power now that she's at the twilight of her life, but I was surprised that she could go without a kind of oppressive sense of dread or a gnawing sense of suspicion upon seeing old Poles. She told me that that's all there but not as powerful or frightening as it once was. For her kids, however, raised in the shadow of the greatest crime in the history of humanity, 'never forget' also means 'never allow the emotional intensity to fade'. To hold on to the emotional intensity or proximity of the horror of the holocaust has been a useful tool in making sure that people actually learn and care about it, but it has scarred my gf's stepmother and her brother somehow and I wonder if we can learn to remember more dispassionately.

― Michael White (Hereward), Friday, 14 January 2005 17:12 (twenty-one years ago)

At what point, if ever, will the insignia and paraphanalia of Nazism lose their power?

It's interesting, it's difficult to think of actual visual images with such a massive power, perhaps I'm missing some but I can't really think of any at the moment.

― Ronan (Ronan), Friday, 14 January 2005 17:26 (twenty-one years ago)

part of the insignia's enduring power is on it's own merit design-wise, even before you consider the unbearable connotations. not least because of it's arachno-esque visage and stark contrast.

the incident has prompted so many questions (am i offended? is it offensive? should other people be offended? who are they to say what he should and shouldn't do? WHY did he do this?! why is it important? what should happen now?) - these have been explored reasonably well in this thread.

― Stevem On X (blueski), Friday, 14 January 2005 17:33 (twenty-one years ago)

Ronan,

http://www.windsorfineart.com/artists/durer/images/Crucifixion.jpg

― Michael White (Hereward), Friday, 14 January 2005 17:37 (twenty-one years ago)

it's difficult to think of actual visual images with such a massive power

sean carruthers to thread

― Stevem On X (blueski), Friday, 14 January 2005 17:38 (twenty-one years ago)

I don't know how I didn't think of that Michael, as I was thinking of the image below, on the bottom, as one which I think is one of the most powerful I've ever seen.

http://www.maerkische-schweiz.com/kultur/gif/heartfield_x.jpg

― Ronan (Ronan), Friday, 14 January 2005 17:45 (twenty-one years ago)

That's John Heartfield, isn't it?

― Michael White (Hereward), Friday, 14 January 2005 17:47 (twenty-one years ago)

It is yeah, I am not sure if the caption is actually part of the original, it wasn't when I saw the image first, but that was the only reproduction of it I could find online.

― Ronan (Ronan), Friday, 14 January 2005 17:48 (twenty-one years ago)

I think it says, essentially, "The Third Reich: Just like the Middle Ages."

― Michael White (Hereward), Friday, 14 January 2005 17:50 (twenty-one years ago)

also 2nd world war related, atrocious in their own terms were the imperial japanese army.
http://www.berzinarchives.com/assets/images/japan_navy_army_ww2_flag.gif

their flag is less fearsome looking though without thinking about the horror behind it.

― ken c (ken c), Friday, 14 January 2005 17:50 (twenty-one years ago)

well, as i asked upthread -- were many black people invited to htis 'natives and colonials' party? were any jews there to be offended?

In my experience, no. Will doesn't have many black friends - don't think any went to his "African-themed" 21st 2 years back. There were about 3 in his year at Eton tho', so in *some* ways unsurprising.

― Captain GRRRios' Giggletits (Barima), Friday, 14 January 2005 17:50 (twenty-one years ago)

all other claims to fame now seem pretty lacking

― Stevem On X (blueski), Friday, 14 January 2005 18:04 (twenty-one years ago)

http://www.trigonalmayhem.com/hitlersubway.jpg

― MY FAVOURITE LIGHTER IS CHEESEBURGER (trigonalmayhem), Friday, 14 January 2005 18:07 (twenty-one years ago)

http://zert0.net/iuti/img/lollercaust.gif

― Hari A$hur$t (Toaster), Friday, 14 January 2005 19:35 (twenty-one years ago)

OH
MY
FUCKING
GOD

― MY FAVOURITE LIGHTER IS CHEESEBURGER (trigonalmayhem), Friday, 14 January 2005 20:33 (twenty-one years ago)

woah the effort some dork puts in to get a cheap laugh...

― Stevem On X (blueski), Friday, 14 January 2005 21:42 (twenty-one years ago)

yeah i didn't make that by the way

― Hari A$hur$t (Toaster), Friday, 14 January 2005 23:12 (twenty-one years ago)

I did make mine, however.

― MY FAVOURITE LIGHTER IS CHEESEBURGER (trigonalmayhem), Saturday, 15 January 2005 01:16 (twenty-one years ago)

That's genuinely one of the things I like about 'The Producers': it reduces rather than nourishes the iconic power of Nazi imagery

The real reason Harry wore the costume?

― tokyo rosemary (rosemary), Saturday, 15 January 2005 02:59 (twenty-one years ago)

I think my brane has been decked.

― dog latin (dog latin), Saturday, 15 January 2005 04:13 (twenty-one years ago)

Just face the facts: the British royal family need to go the way the Romanovs did in Russia when the Bolsheviks took over.

― comrade latebloomer (latebloomer), Saturday, 15 January 2005 06:49 (twenty-one years ago)

yeah and they should open up all their fancy palaces to the public as parks and stuff
like in germany

― MY FAVOURITE LIGHTER IS CHEESEBURGER (trigonalmayhem), Saturday, 15 January 2005 14:13 (twenty-one years ago)

"I now know it was a stupid and silly thing to do. I also now know how dumb it is to listen to Charlie.”

"I have also written (NOT snorted) 1000 lines,been whipped by Dad 30 times and fagged around the whole of Highgate while the staff took the day off and turns to kick my sore red rump."

― Captain GRRRios' Giggletits (Barima), Saturday, 15 January 2005 14:13 (twenty-one years ago)

i take it that declaration is joke, right?

― dog latin (dog latin), Saturday, 15 January 2005 15:32 (twenty-one years ago)

Ja, schweinhund.

― Captain GRRRios' Giggletits (Barima), Saturday, 15 January 2005 15:56 (twenty-one years ago)

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=332581&in_page_id=1770

harry should have listened to charles (not his mate charlie)

One source said: "Charles is also anxious that Harry keeps a low profile in January as that is when he was supposed to be starting at Sandhurst.
"The worry is that with Chelsy around Harry will end up cavorting around and doing stupid things. Obviously that wouldn't look good when the reason he has postponed going to Sandhurst is because he has injured his knee."

...
..

A Royal insider said 20-year-old Harry and Chelsy, a student at Cape Town University, had had a "very relaxed time" when he visited her in South Africa last year....Harry's been told they will have to sleep in separate rooms and can't even have adjoining suites, which may become a bone of contention."

a bone of contention, god.

― ken c (ken c), Saturday, 15 January 2005 16:00 (twenty-one years ago)

This is getting truly ridiculous. A call for a Europe-wide swastika ban:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4178643.stm.

Much as I think Harry was an idiot (true to type) for waering the Nazi uniform and am amazed that he didn't think through the consequences, surely he should still be free to make the choice. Just because something is offensve doesn't necessarily mean it should be legislated against.

― MarkH (MarkH), Sunday, 16 January 2005 14:48 (twenty-one years ago)

the producers is on in london at the moment

a swastika ban would make for a rather lame looking production of this.

― MarkH (MarkH), Sunday, 16 January 2005 14:52 (twenty-one years ago)

Doing this will only deify the swastika in the minds of those who want to go out and deliberately offend others. It's also a breach of basic freedom of speech. You can't just ban a symbol, no matter how offensive or evil it is.

― dog latin (dog latin), Sunday, 16 January 2005 14:53 (twenty-one years ago)

the symbol itself is neither offensive nor evil.
what it has stood for in the past and the connotations we draw from it are of evil and offensive things, but the symbol itself does not possess either of these traits.

don't forget that the nazis bogarted the swastika from some kind of pagan shit that came before, where it had no negative connotation whatsoever.

― MY FAVOURITE LIGHTER IS CHEESEBURGER (trigonalmayhem), Sunday, 16 January 2005 19:16 (twenty-one years ago)

well if they do decide to ban it it will probably just be the nazi connotation that they'd ban rather than all the other stuff like Ganesha's swastika. etc.

but i don't know what banning the symbol is going to achieve.

― ken c (ken c), Sunday, 16 January 2005 19:31 (twenty-one years ago)

"The word swastika is derived from the Sanskrit स्वस्तिक, svastika, meaning any lucky or auspicious object, and in particular a mark made on persons and things to denote good luck. It is composed of su- (cognate with Greek åõ-), meaning "good, well" and asti a verbal abstract to the root as "to be"; svasti thus means "well-being". The suffix -ka forms a diminutive, and svastika might thus be translated literally as "little thing associated with well-being", corresponding roughly to "lucky charm".

The swastika appears in art and design throughout human history, symbolising many different things — luck, Surya (the sun), Brahma, or the Hindu concept of samsara. In fact, the swastika is used primarily as a religious symbol by Hindus – it was first mentioned in the Vedas, the holy texts of Hinduism – but transferred to other Indic religions like Buddhism and Jainism. It also occurs in other Asian, European, and Native American cultures – sometimes as a simple geometrical motif, sometimes as a religious symbol. The almost universally positive meanings of the swastika were subverted in the early twentieth century when it was adopted as the emblem of the National Socialist German Workers Party. Since World War II, most Westerners see it as solely a fascist symbol, leading to incorrect assumptions about its pre-Nazi use and its use in other cultures."

― wikipedia, Sunday, 16 January 2005 19:32 (twenty-one years ago)

the Nazi swastika is backwards from the original.

― dog latin (dog latin), Sunday, 16 January 2005 19:56 (twenty-one years ago)

So I guess we'd better ban mirrors too, in case someone looks at the 'acceptable' kind of swastika in one of them and becomes offended!

― MY FAVOURITE LIGHTER IS CHEESEBURGER (trigonalmayhem), Sunday, 16 January 2005 21:48 (twenty-one years ago)

two years pass...

shame, it'd be funny if he died

― That one guy that quit, Wednesday, 16 May 2007 16:40 (nineteen years ago)

one year passes...

Prince Harry caught on film calling Asian soldier 'Paki'

― James Mitchell, Saturday, 10 January 2009 22:05 (seventeen years ago)

"the appalling jibe."

So what IS he supposed so be or do? If he would only talk like his grandmother the population would call him an out-of-touch stuck up toff, and when he does say what, oh, 80% of the population says, it's appalling and shocking and blablabla? Jeez, Britain is confusing.

― StanM, Saturday, 10 January 2009 22:22 (seventeen years ago)

clue: it's not a harmless abbreviation of 'pakistani'

― admin log special guest star (DG), Saturday, 10 January 2009 22:32 (seventeen years ago)

pakistanm

― velko, Saturday, 10 January 2009 22:33 (seventeen years ago)

we are all prince harry now

― admin log special guest star (DG), Saturday, 10 January 2009 22:34 (seventeen years ago)

I R the worst attempted troll ever :-(

― StanM, Saturday, 10 January 2009 22:35 (seventeen years ago)

A Clarence House spokesman has said that in future the Prince has promised to use language less likely to cause offence to people as he's "bombing the fuck out of their village."

― James Mitchell, Saturday, 10 January 2009 22:57 (seventeen years ago)

"It was just soldiers larking around and Paki was a nickname they call called this guy. It wasn't in the least bit racist."

― schlump, Saturday, 10 January 2009 23:32 (seventeen years ago)

http://news.sky.com/sky-news/content/StaticFile/jpg/2009/Jan/Week2/15200957.jpg

― James Mitchell, Saturday, 10 January 2009 23:43 (seventeen years ago)

jesus bbc stfu about this already

― Goodnight, Mr. Johnson. (country matters), Sunday, 11 January 2009 15:59 (seventeen years ago)

maybe it's jpg graininess but that picture makes camouflage look REALLY effective

― schlump, Sunday, 11 January 2009 16:41 (seventeen years ago)

I don't get it, why would someone take a picture of a floating cigarette?

― StanM, Sunday, 11 January 2009 17:00 (seventeen years ago)

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