how do cereal manufacturers copy other cereals almost identically without problem?

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i mean, somerfield has a chocolate muesli cereal almost a crumb for crumb recreation of the marks and spencer one which has been around for much longer, yet this time of thing is totally okay in the food marketplace. how is this ok?

titchyschneider (titchyschneider), Friday, 14 January 2005 11:43 (twenty-one years ago)

Because you can't copyright recipes? Names is another matter.

Liz :x (Liz :x), Friday, 14 January 2005 11:45 (twenty-one years ago)

whisper *same manufacturer*...

xpost you can copyright recipes. oh yes.

mark grout (mark grout), Friday, 14 January 2005 11:46 (twenty-one years ago)

little known fact: the chicken from Smoky Hills Chicken in Archway tastes exactly like the chicken from AFC Chicken in finsbury park.

ken c (ken c), Friday, 14 January 2005 11:51 (twenty-one years ago)

most products have a generic version and it's perfectly legal (generic prescription drugs for example). If they can make generic anti-depressants, generic cereal shouldn't raise any eyebrows.

mr.ms (daddy warbuxx), Friday, 14 January 2005 11:52 (twenty-one years ago)

copying fried chicken recipes, however, is a crime.

ken c (ken c), Friday, 14 January 2005 11:53 (twenty-one years ago)

The legal parlance is that ideas are not copyrightable, expression of ideas are. You can't copyright "Mismatched Buddy Cop Action Movie with lots of explosions at the end" You can copyright Lethal Weapon.

Therefore, you can copyright recipes if there is any copyrightable creative expression in said recipe. You cannot however just copyright a list of ingredients. You could probably patent a list of ingredients though. Methods of doing something, and compositions of matter are both patentable, in theory. You really shouldn't be able to patent a recipe, because I doubt a truly novel and non-obvious recipe exists when compared with the existing recipes already out there in the world. But there are lots of stupid patents on the books.

Even if a cereal recipe was copyrighted/patented whatever, I doubt the original manufacturer would want to incur court costs proving their recipe had been infringed. The original reply had it right, its more about brand supremacy anyway.

Ash (ashbyman), Friday, 14 January 2005 16:57 (twenty-one years ago)

Just cause I was curious, an example of patented recipe...for a burrito on a stick. Note the fabulous "patent-speak" on display here. People are paid to write like this:

United States Patent 4,491,601
Method of making a readily portable burrito

I claim:

1. A method of making a Mexican-type food item comprising providing a tortilla, laying the tortilla on a flat surface, positioning a substantially rigid and self-supporting elongate member on the tortilla with a substantial portion of its length projecting beyond an edge of the tortilla a sufficient distance to be hand held, with said elongate member located about one-fourth of the width of the tortilla from one edge thereof, folding inwardly and over and beyond the inner portion of the member positioned on the tortilla, the portion of the tortilla between said member and said one edge, then turning the member and the folded over tortilla portion inwardly toward an edge opposite said one edge over that portion of the tortilla extending beyond the member to secure the member to the tortilla, placing a food filler on the flat portion of the tortilla adjacent the member and the portion of the tortilla wrapped therearound, positioning the remaining flat portion of the tortilla around the food filler with the opposite edge in over-lapping relationship with the wrapped portion, closing off end portions of the tortilla beyond the food filler to enclose the food filler, fastening said opposite edge to an underlying portion of the tortilla, and cooking the fastened tortilla in hot liquid by immersing it in the hot liquid to render the tortilla in a semi-rigid, self-sustaining state.

2. A method according to claim 1 wherein said hot liquid is oil at a temperature of 325.degree.-375.degree. F.

3. A method according to claim 1 characterized by cooking the fastened tortilla in said liquid until the tortilla rises to the surface of the liquid, and removing the tortilla from the liquid.

4. A method according to claim 1 characterized by turning the member again toward said opposite edge prior to placing the food filler on the flat portion of the tortilla.

It goes on like that, those interested are encouraged to put the patent number into the USPTO search engine and read the rest. There are other recipes there, my friend once showed me her favorite patent "Method of Exercising a Cat" which consisted of shining a laser pointer on the wall and allowing said feline to chase it around.

IP law is silly.

Ash (ashbyman), Friday, 14 January 2005 17:12 (twenty-one years ago)

5. A method according to claim 1 where a member that was prepared earlier is retrieved from a heat generating device...

mark grout (mark grout), Friday, 14 January 2005 17:17 (twenty-one years ago)

People are paid to write like this:

People like you!

luna (luna.c), Friday, 14 January 2005 17:24 (twenty-one years ago)

I am *not* a patent lawyer. Bite your tongue.

Besides, why do you think I want you to get this brothel of yours of the ground so I can be your hired goon.

Ash (ashbyman), Friday, 14 January 2005 18:22 (twenty-one years ago)

I'm gonna start a restaurant called Mexican-type Food Items.

martin m. (mushrush), Friday, 14 January 2005 18:24 (twenty-one years ago)

C'mon, that portable burrito is just a chimichanga on a stick! That shouldn't be patentable.

o. nate (onate), Friday, 14 January 2005 18:28 (twenty-one years ago)

I know, I know, I'm sorry.

You'll be the best hired goon ever...

luna (luna.c), Friday, 14 January 2005 18:34 (twenty-one years ago)

You can't copyright no motherfuckin' froot loops!

Flavor Flav (Begs2Differ), Friday, 14 January 2005 19:17 (twenty-one years ago)

Reverse engineering. If you can prove that you arrived a the same result without access to any privileged information (i.e. trade secrets) then there's nothing the copied company can do. Because the list of ingredients is there for the whole world to see, and the taste, texture and aroma are self-evident, a copycat has a great deal of information to work with from the start.

I should imagine the more common difficulty is in designing the machines that will mass manufacture the copied product.

Aimless (Aimless), Friday, 14 January 2005 19:31 (twenty-one years ago)


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