political affiliatons of the stars

That said, I love some ultra-political groups (political in their very identity, that is) - from Ultra Red to Boyd Rice.

It's the same reason I love lots of religious music (old country and gospel) - i respect the passion. I respect and appreciate the vigour. But you see how it's different? When Hank Williams sings "Jesus Remembered Me" and "I Saw The Light," or when Gary Davis sings "I Am The Light of this World" they fucking mean it. And that's genuine, and it translates over into the music. Steve Earle's "John Walker's Blues" was genuine. When Earth Crisis sing "I can't stan by and let the innocent die," it's genuine. Fucking 'working class hero' Bruce Springsteen, who has a rider that puts J-Lo's to shame, is an embarrassment.

But I probably wouldn't stop or start listening to any band because of their political affiliation. That said, most of the bands making asses of themselves right now (with the exception of Sonic Youth) are bands I wouldn't listen to anyway.

I also resent the assumption that artists/ bands are all socialists to begin with, which is why I appreciate you starting this thread with the question - what if the shoe was on the other foot? What if it was Zwan writing songs against Jerry Brown or Jesse Jackson? How "right-on, dude" would everyone be then?

This looks funny coming from someone whose moniker is a play on Mr. "The Revolution Will Not Be Televised" himself.

"It's interesting because you all ask these questions," he said, "but at the moment, quite obviously, the media is sick and tired of people in my position giving their opinions about [the war]. And yet, you're kind of encouraging me to give my opinion about it... And after giving my opinion, you're going to say, 'Why doesn't he shut up?'"

the idea that they are less qualified to talk about their views than anyone else sucks even more.

if I was somehow famous and thought that anyone would listen to me about how sickened I am about the goddamned inferno that this martin-sheen-in-the-dead-zone-style U.S. president is dragging us into, I'd speak the fuck up about it tout suite

I would do the same if I believed in the shit. which I don't.

and I wouldn't worry about what roger adultery or girl scout heroin thought about it

Being an American musician and speaking up for what you believe in = pathetic.

Am I getting this right?

political affliliations affect my enjoyment to some degree. just like album covers, what image they're projecting, what other music/culture they affliliate themselves with. i mean i'm human and this is pop culture.

though i had an extremely frustrating experience trying to help with a ladyfest where a band's political affliation became a deciding factor if we should even ask them to play or 'boycott' them. i guess there's a healthy balance and either extreme is kind of unbearable.

what band was this? what were their political affiliations? and did you finally let them play?

Other points: a lot of people dropped Morrissey in the mid-90s when he relcorded a song called 'National Front Disco' and took to wearing a union jack at concerts. there was a lot of 'Morrissey is a Nazi!' shite spewed out in the media at the time. Ironically, he was probably making the best music of his solo career around then, and I have a great fondness for the albums from then.

My feeling is that celebrities and musicians are as entitled to have opinions as anyone else, and are as entitled to try and propagate their opinions. It's not their fault if they have more opportunity to make their views known to people. If they start from altruistic principles and are well-informed about a topic their opinions will be interesting and helpful to others, if not they won't be.

another thing: has anyone here who isn't a Nazi ever heard and liked any music by far right musicmakers like Skrewdriver or Burzum?

Erhm, wait, how does Hank Williams "mean" it anymore so than Bruce Springsteen? I love "I Saw The Light" as much as the next guy, but if you're gonna talk about ppl who talk the talk but don't walk the walk re: their convictions, Hank Williams is a much better example than Bruce Springsteen and J-Lo combined.

As fer the subject in general, the answer is of course:
* I can enjoy the music of ppl whose politics I don't agree with
*I can hate the music of artists whose politics I agree with
*When artists whose music I love share my political views, it's a happy land.

Skrewdriver, I really couldn't care less about, though as a punk band, they are above average songwriters / players. I don't own any of their records because I'm not frivilous enough. But to automatically detest them because of what you think you know about them is 100x more ignorant than Rahowa or a cast of misled riot grrrl banshees could ever be.

Yeah, but that's just *one* part of his ouevre- a lot of other songs were about total redemption, sung as if he had attained it. Which he hadn't. And they're no less affecting for it, just like Broooce's working class anthems are great no matter how isolated his life may be. It's FICTION, folks!

(and I bet ya The People would want a house in a nice closed community if They could afford it, too. Also Charlie would be an, erhm, difficult drinking partner at best- go ask Elvis)

but i don't think Bruce is writing fiction - Abner Louima was, like, really shot. Protest songs are usually pretty crappy anyway.

i'm not picking on Bruce, here, because everyone from Jeff Foxwrothy to Roseanne to Mellencamp is guilty of the same thing (but to lesser degrees) - is it necessary to forfiet your identity as "blue collar" or "white trash" when you have more money than God? And if so, what then? I think all of these people have asked themselves this in their private moments when they are alone in bed at night and ultimately chose the path most traveled by.

but i shall not dive into my misadventures with ladyfest. it was one of those things you pin some hopes on and instead it just makes you hate everything about everything. politics ended up suffocating all else.

The same way anyone can like Public Enemy.

Anyway, there are tons of crappy nazi bands and a few excellent ones. The point where nazi bands (and extreme leftist artists too) get irritating to me is when they start preaching or threatening (as most oi! was, stupidity about lost jobs and beating up blacks), practical politics as you might say, while the more metaphysical use of that mythical "lost European honour and spirituality caused by judeo-christian values" stuff employed by Burzum/Graveland/etc generally doesn't bother me at all and quite effectively enhances the atmosphere they're building.

Skrewdriver:
Take no shit from anyone because Great Britain rules
We will fight the Communists, because Communists are fools
Try to take our nation, and give it to the Paks
We won't take it anymore, we're going to take our nation back

Burzum:
Through the coppice we gazed
at everything
that reminded us
of other times
and said all hope
had vanished for ever...
We listened to the singing of Elves and
the soughing of water
What once was, is now over
all the blood...
all the longing and the
sorrow, that reigned
and the emotions, that were
tangible
are no more...
for ever...

linking Mr Burzum to nonviolent artists is disingenuous, given that he is in prison for murder and for the burning of churches.

just to shift it from music to another artform - does Polanski being a convicted child rapist put you off his films?

it doesn't with me, although I would rather they had put him away when they had the chance.

And I've only actually bought an album before the fact. (Like when I said I didn't know why Burzum had gotten such a bad reputation, exacly)

Of course Vikernes is no lyrical genius, and it's all thematically fairly archetypical. There wouldn't have been a lot of interest in interpreting/dissecting his lyrics if Vikernes was your average neighbour rather than a notorious murderous, satanic arsonist turned white supremacist. But crude as these lyrics might be (not to mention the vocal delivery), they do the job of enhancing the melancholic, hopeless, not-of-this-world atmosphere of the music very effectively. It's not material for ironic distancing nor is it something that persuasively grabs you by the throat, the whole concept of Burzums droning, repetitive, trance inducing music is to immerse yourself in a certain atmosphere. If knowledge of Vikernes' politics or the lyrical themes are a deterrent, you'll probably not get much enjoyment out of it - likewise, no offence meant.