micro-drum'n'bass ..?

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It strikes me that a lot of the interest/detail in microhouse comes from the fact that these people are writing drum loops with samples that are (gasp) not purpose-made drum samples, as much as from programming adeptitude.

So how long before we see micro-drum'n'bass? Would it even work? Ok, I know what I'm going to experiment with this weekend...

I was listening to Photek's Modus Operandi the other night, after hearing Optical's Cryogenesis on the radio the other morning, and noticed that d'n'b was actually a lot more interesting 'back then,' ie, when it was not as hard and not as fast. (It was the first time I'd listened to Photek in a while, and it does take a lot of effort to get into, but is quite varied in its own way. It feels like it's trying to push something in a particular direction but doesn't have the balls or the nous or something to pull it off.. It's basing the beat on some fairly weird samples [and listen in the background - is that an air-conditioning unit or something? I wish more music made sample-gathering more explicit, like this one does], but they're not weird /enough/, or their weirdness is not sufficiently acknowledged musically, to push that direction sufficiently.)

I know there's a lot of not-so-hard d'n'b coming out of New Zealand and Australia at the moment but it's still stupidly fast, and doesn't have the kind of production delicacy and sparseness that makes microhouse so nice to listen to.

― damian_nz (damian_nz), Friday, 11 June 2004 04:26 (twenty-two years ago)

It seems you're proposing that Photek *is* micro-dnb. The short, glitchy samples, assembled with incredible precision are certainly abundant in his music.

― Barry Bruner (Barry Bruner), Friday, 11 June 2004 04:45 (twenty-two years ago)

nah, it doesn't have the right sort of, umm, something, to fit alongside microhouse. It's certainly a type of d'n'b that is ripe for experimentation, but it's not got it. It's like it's lacking a layer or two. Or something.

Also the samples aren't really short or glitchy...

― damian_nz (damian_nz), Friday, 11 June 2004 04:51 (twenty-two years ago)

i think you're doing microhouse a disservice by locating all of the frisson in the sampling. it's like you're extending what's great about pantytec to a whole genre.

when will we see d'n'b like pantytec? we already sort of did. see the thread on "the great fake jungle rush of 96" for a bunch of examples.

― vahid (vahid), Friday, 11 June 2004 04:57 (twenty-two years ago)

also there's a ton of drill'n'bass that fits those parameters and, well, we saw how well that worked out.

damien, i must say i salute your mentalism. your threads on electronic music are like mindbending zen koans. i am still puzzling over this one and this one.

― vahid (vahid), Friday, 11 June 2004 05:00 (twenty-two years ago)

AARGH i am an antigenius, i meant this one

― vahid (vahid), Friday, 11 June 2004 05:00 (twenty-two years ago)

I was thinking Photek too sorta (especially "Consciousness" with those great snare hits that sound like bamboo striking rusty pipes) but yeah really the answer is drill & bass.

The vital ingredient that makes microhouse work - apart from the "micro" - is the inherently repetitive nature of the house groove, and the way that the intricacies, complexities and abnormalities of the micro rub up against this basic repetition.

Classic d&b was all about moving said intricacies, complexities etc. into the front and center of the groove itself - mashed breaks, incredibly complex rhythms etc - which kind of renders any attempt to "micro" that sound redundant in advance, because there's no inherent conflict at work (and indeed a lot of the sampling in those early jungle tracks was rhythmiclly sophisticated enough to pre-empt such a move anyway).

The closest real parallel I can think of is that early stage of techstep/neurofunk, where the beats were repetitive enough that you could productively "micro" them, but not so fast/numbing for it to become a pointless effort. See something like Dom & Roland's "Elektra", with its cluster bombs of rattling metallic snare effects bouncing off the central groove.

(note that 2-step sidesteps a lot of the problems with jungle in this regard - hence Horsepower Productions' early work)

― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Friday, 11 June 2004 05:23 (twenty-two years ago)

Matrix 'Mute'

― stevem (blueski), Friday, 11 June 2004 09:02 (twenty-two years ago)

the first Icarus disc on Hydrogen dukebox (Nosferatu) might fit for the micro bit as it has loads of small skittering noises set amidst fairly spacious full kit breaks. but i couldn't make a link with the current microhouse sound(s)

― mullygrubber (gaz), Friday, 11 June 2004 09:13 (twenty-two years ago)

two weeks pass...

hmm?

― damian_nz (damian_nz), Thursday, 1 July 2004 22:30 (twenty-one years ago)

Classic d&b was all about moving said intricacies, complexities etc. into the front and center of the groove itself - mashed breaks, incredibly complex rhythms etc

Err, I utterly disagree. Drum'n'bass is about strongly pushing the beat and then strongly pulling it. Classically that came from having the kick on 1 and 3 or 1 and 2 1/2 which did the pushing and the funkydrummer rhythm which did the pulling. The stuff I find more interesting is the 1 and 2 1/2 stuff: push, push, (pull-pull-pull pull p-p-pull) push, push, (p-p-pull pup, pull, pull pup pull)push, push, &c. which is basically very simple and very repetitive. And that's the interesting, more jungly d'n'b. There's vast scope for microfication there.

― damian_nz (damian_nz), Thursday, 1 July 2004 22:41 (twenty-one years ago)

what the fuck is that!? its fantastic!

― jed_ (jed), Thursday, 1 July 2004 22:42 (twenty-one years ago)

it's me :)

cheers

― damian_nz (damian_nz), Thursday, 1 July 2004 22:43 (twenty-one years ago)

this is one of the best things i have heard for a looong time!

― jed_ (jed), Thursday, 1 July 2004 22:45 (twenty-one years ago)

have you heard Robert Ashley's "Automatic Writing"? you should!

― jed_ (jed), Thursday, 1 July 2004 22:46 (twenty-one years ago)

wow! thanks!

I wrote it on the train on the way home from my parent's house the other night. Laptops rock.

I'm taking a CD of stuff a little like this down the road to RadioActive this afternoon - hopefully it'll make the playlist.

(xpost) nope, but cheers for the recommendation

― damian_nz (damian_nz), Thursday, 1 July 2004 22:48 (twenty-one years ago)

Automatic Writing

try and find the 40-odd minute version rather than the 10 minute excerpt most commonly found on fileshare.

i like "ethical" ALOT.

― jed_ (jed), Thursday, 1 July 2004 22:52 (twenty-one years ago)

wow, Automatic Writing sounds fantastic

― damian_nz (damian_nz), Thursday, 1 July 2004 23:33 (twenty-one years ago)

I mean, Wolfman sounds fantastic.

I knew what I meant.

― damian_nz (damian_nz), Friday, 2 July 2004 04:29 (twenty-one years ago)

that was a bit of a duff link - i meant to link you to automatic writing not wolfman.

― jed_ (jed), Friday, 2 July 2004 06:40 (twenty-one years ago)

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