Jason Gross' Fave Pop Music writing of 2004

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http://rockcritics.com/jasongross2004_intro.html

Somewhat interesting, somewhat ho-hum(I'm sure I read better stuff but can't remember it right now)

― steve-k, Sunday, 16 January 2005 07:38 (twenty-one years ago)

hey hey, Dave Q is mentioned in the second link.. as is Ned's fan page!

― donut christ (donut), Sunday, 16 January 2005 07:51 (twenty-one years ago)

A M. Matos piece on Dylan's book (and other related books) is in there.

― steve-k, Sunday, 16 January 2005 16:33 (twenty-one years ago)

Well, first off, Props to Gross for helping to compile all of this, and the great intro piece in the first place. I don't know if I would have (been bold enough to have) included a "Worst writing" section myself, but there are some funny ones in there.

― donut christ (donut), Sunday, 16 January 2005 20:14 (twenty-one years ago)

hey hey, Dave Q is mentioned in the second link.. as is Ned's fan page!

?!?! Wow! Now I really need to update the links since a number of new pieces have been published. How cool. Thanks for the plug, Mr. Gross!

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 16 January 2005 20:19 (twenty-one years ago)

Hahah, the worst writing section is justified by one inclusion alone...

THE "...WAS THE DRUMMER FOR GAY DAD" ANTI-RAP PIECE!

As memorably discussed here:

Why do people who hate music write about music?

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 16 January 2005 20:22 (twenty-one years ago)

Nice to see Hornby getting his long-overdue dues in the "Worst Writing" category. Now if only the author of the piece could have resisted the Hornbyite temptation to have a Pavlovian go at blogs in line two of his introduction, I could have taken him remotely seriously.

― Marcello Carlin, Monday, 17 January 2005 09:10 (twenty-one years ago)

um yr siding with the bloggers in the dan rather affair carlin?

― j blount (papa la bas), Monday, 17 January 2005 09:16 (twenty-one years ago)

maybe it would help to know/find out what he's talking about before you have a pavlovian go at it next time there.

― j blount (papa la bas), Monday, 17 January 2005 09:16 (twenty-one years ago)

His writing doesn't make me interested enough to care about what he's talking about, except from the evident standard perspective of the print journalist about to made as redundant and 19th-century as lighthouse keepers or workhouses.

― Marcello Carlin, Monday, 17 January 2005 09:19 (twenty-one years ago)

correction: "about to be made as redundant"

― Marcello Carlin, Monday, 17 January 2005 09:20 (twenty-one years ago)

although when it comes to discussing web-based music writing (which it would seem who you think he's referring to when he mentions 'biting from bloggers')(ps. he's not, do try and keep up) i can't imagine too many with stronger cred than JASON GROSS. unless the internet is about to be made as redundant and 19th-century as lighthouse keepers and workhouses.

― j blount (papa la bas), Monday, 17 January 2005 09:20 (twenty-one years ago)

If Jason Gross were credible I would have heard of him at school. As it is there has been no important American music writer since the time I was at school.

― Marcello Carlin, Monday, 17 January 2005 09:22 (twenty-one years ago)

― jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 17 January 2005 09:23 (twenty-one years ago)

marcello can you name one of the 'biting bloggers' he's taking about?

― j blount (papa la bas), Monday, 17 January 2005 09:26 (twenty-one years ago)

i think yr fake ghosts are starting to get to you old boy!

― j blount (papa la bas), Monday, 17 January 2005 09:27 (twenty-one years ago)

Ha ha ha...

― Naive Teen Idol (Naive Teen Idol), Monday, 17 January 2005 09:33 (twenty-one years ago)

Mr Gross knows as much about blogs as I do about endomysial antibodies.

― Marcello Carlin, Monday, 17 January 2005 09:33 (twenty-one years ago)

so you can't name one then?

― j blount (papa la bas), Monday, 17 January 2005 09:34 (twenty-one years ago)

if you need help "surfing" the internet old boy just ask!

― j blount (papa la bas), Monday, 17 January 2005 09:35 (twenty-one years ago)

The important thing here is that Mr Gross is seemingly unable to name one.

― Marcello Carlin, Monday, 17 January 2005 09:38 (twenty-one years ago)

why would he go into depth about rathergate in a piece about bad music writing? you still don't know what he's talking about do you? do you need help with google (google is the name of a site, it's what we call a "search engine")(site's are these places on the internet)?

― j blount (papa la bas), Monday, 17 January 2005 09:47 (twenty-one years ago)

Hi Jimmy! I live in London, England! We Limeys have never heard of this "Dan Rather"! Is he like Dan Fogelberg or Dan Loggins or someone? Has he ever made a record as good as "Longer"? Is his beard clipped with forceps?

― Marcello Carlin, Monday, 17 January 2005 09:51 (twenty-one years ago)

well if you don't know what he's talking about then why did if offend you so? does it hurt yr feelings when people talk about stuff and you don't know what they're talking about? do they not have blogs yet in london, england? is google blocked per orders of the queen?

― j blount (papa la bas), Monday, 17 January 2005 09:55 (twenty-one years ago)

i mean really you english should start maybe doing a little research of your own before you climb into gop laps.

― j blount (papa la bas), Monday, 17 January 2005 09:57 (twenty-one years ago)

of course if you're response is pavlovian then i guess you can't help it! lapdogs will be lapdogs!

― j blount (papa la bas), Monday, 17 January 2005 09:58 (twenty-one years ago)

Fascinating stuff. The debunking of the liberal media, as in "liberal" only when you agree with it/them.

You wouldn't get ITN's Mark Austin indulging in loony left crowing over forged documents, that's for sure. We have higher standards here.

― Marcello Carlin, Monday, 17 January 2005 10:02 (twenty-one years ago)

We have higher standards here.

Like the ones at the BBC.

― don weiner, Monday, 17 January 2005 13:07 (twenty-one years ago)

Fuck the BBC.

― Marcello Carlin, Monday, 17 January 2005 13:27 (twenty-one years ago)

So music writing, then!

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 17 January 2005 16:10 (twenty-one years ago)

I don't like how Gross seems to largely neglect reviews, Amateuristian rock-crit poetics, or even hard reporting in favor of stuff that strikes me as daily paper hack-work, such as (not counting some of the usual suspects) the Edward Morris and Richard Harrington pieces (and I'm also not convinced the "King of the Pirates" piece wasn't a hoax) -- nice but not especially original sentiments phrased not especially originally. Perhaps this is why he uses "scribe" instead of "writer"?

Weren't we gonna have "...was the drummer for Gay Dad" t-shirts printed up?

― Michael Daddino (epicharmus), Monday, 17 January 2005 17:14 (twenty-one years ago)

That was suggested over on that thread and I would love to have one.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 17 January 2005 17:16 (twenty-one years ago)

Well, remember the ill-fated Freaky Trigger t-shirt I made? It'd be keen (and expensive) to print some up for the EMP music conference but -- erm oh -- the in-group buggery that entails is both unsettling and the reason to do it.

― Michael Daddino (epicharmus), Monday, 17 January 2005 17:21 (twenty-one years ago)

At least CafePress makes this fairly easy to do these days.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 17 January 2005 17:24 (twenty-one years ago)

on what planet could Jim DeRo's Sgt. Pepper's essay be considered great?

― dead horse beater, Monday, 17 January 2005 17:32 (twenty-one years ago)

"I don't like how Gross seems to largely neglect reviews, Amateuristian rock-crit poetics, or even hard reporting in favor of stuff that strikes me as daily paper hack-work..."

Michael OTM. There's not much variety here--nothing much from music magazines, few profiles from any media, little music blog stuff. I like Gross' Perfect Sound Forever website, so I expected a bit more from him for this.

― steve-k, Monday, 17 January 2005 18:35 (twenty-one years ago)

isn't it about now when someone complains about he lack 'o' female voices represented?

― shookout (shookout), Monday, 17 January 2005 18:52 (twenty-one years ago)

Equality is such a cliché.

― Michael Daddino (epicharmus), Monday, 17 January 2005 18:58 (twenty-one years ago)

which hard reporting stories do you think he missed, Michael?

― don weiner, Monday, 17 January 2005 19:09 (twenty-one years ago)

well wolk's continuing, er, coverage of recording industry vs. downloaders deserves a shoutout. i don't think i've seen a 'best music writing' list or compendium yet that remotely matches what i might've put (and i don't really think about what i woulda put)(except 'some dave q' in which case i guess this does match up some). the 50,000th piece contrarily 'taking on' sgt. peppers vs. the 300,000th piece praising sgt. peppers strikes me as a lose-lose scenario and that's before derogatis involvement. overall too rockist sympathetic (shock, surprise, though gross is a rockist i can sympathise with)(even if i often can't sympathise with what he sympathises with)(eg. other rockists), like the 'best' books, which means these things are gonna pretty much always tend to be dull dull dull.

― j blount (papa la bas), Monday, 17 January 2005 20:44 (twenty-one years ago)

This thread is just dying to go somewhere, I can feel it.

― Chris Ott (Chris Ott), Monday, 17 January 2005 21:38 (twenty-one years ago)

Yep, Wolk's deserves a shoutout but his work doesn't represent hard reporting more than anything Gross listed. What's Wolk's longest piece on that subject anyway, Blount--700 words? And saying there wasn't any hardcore reporting completely ignores the fact that Gross listed "The Long Tail", which was the best industry article I read all year--actually, most of Wired's industry reporting is top notch, and once again they had a solid issue on music this year (not to mention the most recent issue, which delves into Bit Torrent et al more than any other mainstream outlet has.)

That said, Eric Boehlert has done a lot of great work for Salon on music with equally good depth; I can't remember what he's done this year that was great but I'm sure if I bothered to look I'd find a piece that had some good hard reporting.

And if you think that the whole list is too rockist, it's pretty clear that Gross likes Jeff Chang's work--Chang's stuff on that issue is far superior to what ran in the NYT, so if Gross is rockist at least he seems self-aware.

― don weiner, Monday, 17 January 2005 21:59 (twenty-one years ago)

nah, i'm not really 'blastin' the list as rockist, just that much of it is the same ol song and dance, variations on entries from previous lists (and to be honest i'm probably conflating it with the 'best' books, where that really is the case). actually a list that's purely reporting (since that side of music writing gets pretty much ignored) might be best, or at least 70% reporting with the rest divvied between reviews, essays, whatever thinkpiece got the rockcrits panties twisted this year.

― j blount (papa la bas), Monday, 17 January 2005 22:09 (twenty-one years ago)

whats wrong w/ the piece that was in the ny times?

― djdee2005 (djdee2005), Monday, 17 January 2005 22:11 (twenty-one years ago)

Chang's article on the rockism in the DaCapo books makes a more succinct, revealing argument than Kaleefa's did.

― don weiner, Monday, 17 January 2005 22:41 (twenty-one years ago)

The two articles were about entirely different things though. Well, not entirely different, but the purpose of each piece was pretty different.

― djdee2005 (djdee2005), Monday, 17 January 2005 22:43 (twenty-one years ago)

much of it is the same ol song and dance

cut and paste this into every list thread ever, repeat ad infinitum

― bugged out, Monday, 17 January 2005 22:48 (twenty-one years ago)

which hard reporting stories do you think he missed, Michael?

Mmm...no, there's definitely more "hard reporting" there than I implied -- more than reviews or poetics, that's for sure.

I was going to name Douglas Wolk's stuff, too, as well as downhillbattle.org (again, the whole website and all of its smart-ass associates, not any specfic part), if it counts, because I like its gadfly attitude, even if I'm not entirely on its bandwagon, either politically or aesthetically. Though I'm not sure if that counts as "reportage" -- though they have linked to good writing from other sources.

― Michael Daddino (epicharmus), Monday, 17 January 2005 23:54 (twenty-one years ago)

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