This is the thread where we discuss the alternatives to oil

Wha--? Oh. I'll get my hat then.

Oh, and fission: besides the nuclear waste, it will soon take more energy to mine/process fissionable material than the energy you would get from it.

One of the peculiar side effects of an oil-based economy is that it tends to promote a worldwide 'monoculture' of energy use. It's almost like Ireland before the famine, where so much rested on the potato as a food source. Energy from mechanical (wind, waves, hydroelectric, watermill), solar or geothermal sources tend to be local and idiosyncratic. For example, Iceland would be crazy not to use geothermal, while Algeria would be smarter to use solar. Mongolia won't be tapping tidal energy, but the wind blows all day long.

The one absolutely predictable thing about the future of energy after oil is that efficiency will be of paramount importance. Either that, or we'll revert to a slave-based economy.

Plus "diesel" sounds so tuff: Vin Diesel, Diesel for successful living, etc.

The problem with any plant-based energy source, besides the poor energy returns, is that its requires diverting land from food production to fuel production. Eventually, you will have to face a "grow food or fuel?" decision. Factor in that without fossil fuels agricultural production will drop up to 75%, we will for a while be forced to choose food.

This ties back with population. It is not physically possible to grow enough biomass to burn that would equal current fossil fuel expenditure per capita.

Where'd you hear that last part? How soon?

And didn't some guy called Tom Bearden create a machine that produced greater output energy / input energy ?

I may be talking bollocks

A book called _Beyond Oil_, I forget the authour. Soon as in possibly now. The nuclear power industry was sort of subsidized by the nuclear weapons industry. The government would pay for the extraction of weapons material and get power-generating material as a byproduct. When you look at the whole picture, nuclear never gave as great an energy return as it seemed. The one way it could increase its returns is through breeder reactors, which have their own set of problems.

And btw, if you ever heard the story about the trillions of barrels of oil shale and tar sands in north america that will save us all... same problem. They are so diffuclt to extract that the energy you spent to do it barely covers the energy you get from it.

Read Ed's first post again. He explains why hydrogen is not an energy source.

>And didn't some guy called Tom Bearden create a machine that produced greater output energy / input energy ?

Well, violating the first law of thermodynamics would be nice, but, no.

"A Nobel Prize-winning chemist says the impending world energy shortage requires several miracles of science that nanotechnology can help to deliver."

Smalley described how nanotechnology can also be used to create "super batteries" for storing hydrogen at homes or businesses to avoid using the electricity grid at peak times of demand....Smalley believes that finding a replacement for fossil fuels is essential to solving the world's top 10 problems, which he said include poverty, hunger, water, the environment and terrorism. Affordable energy would also help to reduce the economic imbalance between have and have nots....

A substantial investment would be needed to create the energy technologies, which Smalley said could happen as soon as 2020, since, "It's time to stop pussyfooting around and get it done." He outlined a nickel and dime approach – a 5-cent tax on each gallon of gas for the next five years, and then a 10-year tax of 10 cents per gallon.

Even if the energy problem isn't solved by then, he said, "At worst we will have created many new technologies and industries for the future."

I think you're wrong.

Read Ed's first post again. He explains why hydrogen is not an energy source.

Well what the hell is this then?, I knew I was right about that.

Nevertheless, car and energy companies are pumping billions of dollars into building prototypes of vehicles and filling stations, while governments are pursuing hydrogen as a potential replacement for car fuel.")